Maximizing Battery Life

[dtech]

no, ASS is not active. It's a symptom i've noticed with prior failing batteries also.

I am not driving this thing once a week. It's 4 years old and 72K miles. I have never had a vehicle have such terrible vehicle management.

I'll look to get alternator tested. I really don't THINK i should need to go to external trickle charger for 24-48 hours between uses, nor go to the lengths of an onboard desulfator, but seems ford may not have left me much choice.

You could try disco the BMS, I did so 2+ yrs back and my battery seems to have accepted that, I largely agree with your comments on vehicle mgmt esp as pertains to the charging system, we all have different vehicle use scenarios and Ford's system seems to be designed along the lines of one size fits all - maybe with increased AI adoption they can design something that actually recognizes and adapts to different vehicle usage, instead of having owners futz around with trying obtain the ideal SOC.

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[got3fords]

Have your alternator checked. Also, check battery terminal connections for looseness or corrosion.

So if the alternator tests bad, then it's been bad since he took delivery?

 

[TJC]

You could try disco the BMS, I did so 2+ yrs back and my battery seems to have accepted that, I largely agree with your comments on vehicle mgmt esp as pertains to the charging system, we all have different vehicle use scenarios and Ford's system seems to be designed along the lines of one size fits all - maybe with increased AI adoption they can design something that actually recognizes and adapts to different vehicle usage, instead of having owners futz around with trying obtain the ideal SOC.

I think it is not so much "one size fits all", as it is that they dumped a sh@tload of electronic toys/sensors that raised the electrical consumption level, combined with power draining "greenie ideology addon crap" that weakened the electrical power generation and storage capability of the truck....

Like only charging the smallest possible battery they could get by with to only 70% capacity with a charging algo that put greenie objectives over sound engineering principles that have a proven track record going back the last 50 years.

ASS enabled = 2 years less life of the battery. Ford knows this. They have first class engineers employeed there.

This is simply one of many compromises made in the name of greenie objectives.

The same with the 10 speed transmission. No one needs 10 speeds in a transmission... unless you are chasing the optimal engine rpm window for fuel efficiency.

Add in that extra ELECTRIC Transmission fluid pump needed to keep the transmission pressure up when the engine shuts down at a stop light. (Thank you ASS)

These are just a few examples of the many changes made in the name of efficiency over reliability.

I hope the pendelum swings back to sanity in the near future.

 

[dtech]

From an article regards development of the voltage regulator, so in terms of battery life we are regressing, unless of course ones takes heroic measures like unplugging the bms.

"The third brush, constant current generator dominated the automobile industry for more than 20 years, until about 1936. It had many problems. For example in summer when driving on long trips the well informed driver would keep his lights on to avoid overcharging his batter. But the majority of drivers simply allowed battery life to be destroyed overcharging. The life of a battery was two years, if you were lucky. In winter there was a worse problem. Trips were much shorter and there was more need for headlights. The generator had a hard time keeping up with battery needs. Dead batteries on cold winter mornings were a common occurrence."

https://ethw.org/First-Hand:The_Story_of_the_Automobile_Voltage_Regulator

Just wanted add I remember back in the day on several of my old 60s era beaters with the coil and spring tensioned contact points voltage regulator having to adjust the spring to up the charging voltage in cold weather to prolong the life of the battery, and also recall taking the alternator from an old amc car and mounting it on a Datsun 510 when that alternator failed, it was plug and play. This now has jogged my memory in recalling how many dilapidated beater cars I drove for yrs back in the 60s, 70s and 80s.

 

[TJC]

From an article regards development of the voltage regulator, so in terms of battery life we are regressing, unless of course ones takes heroic measures like unplugging the bms.

"The third brush, constant current generator dominated the automobile industry for more than 20 years, until about 1936. It had many problems. For example in summer when driving on long trips the well informed driver would keep his lights on to avoid overcharging his batter. But the majority of drivers simply allowed battery life to be destroyed overcharging. The life of a battery was two years, if you were lucky. In winter there was a worse problem. Trips were much shorter and there was more need for headlights. The generator had a hard time keeping up with battery needs. Dead batteries on cold winter mornings were a common occurrence."

https://ethw.org/First-Hand:The_Story_of_the_Automobile_Voltage_Regulator

Just wanted add I remember back in the day on several of my old 60s era beaters with the coil and spring tensioned contact points voltage regulator having to adjust the spring to up the charging voltage in cold weather to prolong the life of the battery, and also recall taking the alternator from an old amc car and mounting it on a Datsun 510 when that alternator failed, it was plug and play. This now has jogged my memory in recalling how many dilapidated beater cars I drove for yrs back in the 60s, 70s and 80s.

LOL, We ALL did! ( drive beaters...) the difference was they were easily repairable.

I rebuilt many an engine with no need for complex tools. I'd pull that Chevy small block V8, remove the cyinder ridge with a ridge remeamer, then mic and hone the cyinders, install new rings on the pistons, compress them, and reinstall them in the block with the wood handle of a hammer. I could have it rebuilt and up and running over a weekend. Maybe a couplel of more days if the crank needed turning and it had to go to the machine shop.

I used to adjust the voltage regulators as well, but I tended to go the other direction being south of Miami. I remember vacuum windshield wiper motors in my 55 Chevy (265 V8 in it). ! had electric when I upgraded to the 57 283 V8 Chevy.

I still miss the wing vent windows and bench seats. Cars were transportation, and a great place to spend time with your girl. Friday/Saturday nights at A & W getting a steak sandfwich, fries and cold root beer delivered to your window on a tray... Listening to 560 WQAM in Miami.

Good times!

 

[maxbottomtime]

From an article regards development of the voltage regulator, so in terms of battery life we are regressing, unless of course ones takes heroic measures like unplugging the bms.

"The third brush, constant current generator dominated the automobile industry for more than 20 years, until about 1936. It had many problems. For example in summer when driving on long trips the well informed driver would keep his lights on to avoid overcharging his batter. But the majority of drivers simply allowed battery life to be destroyed overcharging. The life of a battery was two years, if you were lucky. In winter there was a worse problem. Trips were much shorter and there was more need for headlights. The generator had a hard time keeping up with battery needs. Dead batteries on cold winter mornings were a common occurrence."

https://ethw.org/First-Hand:The_Story_of_the_Automobile_Voltage_Regulator

Just wanted add I remember back in the day on several of my old 60s era beaters with the coil and spring tensioned contact points voltage regulator having to adjust the spring to up the charging voltage in cold weather to prolong the life of the battery, and also recall taking the alternator from an old amc car and mounting it on a Datsun 510 when that alternator failed, it was plug and play. This now has jogged my memory in recalling how many dilapidated beater cars I drove for yrs back in the 60s, 70s and 80s.

Good to know that it's a century later and the same problem.

 

[got3fords]

LOL, We ALL did! ( drive beaters...) the difference was they were easily repairable.

I rebuilt many an engine with no need for complex tools. I'd pull that Chevy small block V8, remove the cyinder ridge with a ridge remeamer, then mic and hone the cyinders, install new rings on the pistons, compress them, and reinstall them in the block with the wood handle of a hammer.

I went to shop class in high school and learned all the basics. My dad often tasked me with stuff life climbing under the hood of our '68 Impala and adjusting the points or the '74 Chevy truck and check the timing.
BTW, what the heck is a remeamer?

 

[airline tech]

He meant to (TYPE) Ridge Reamer.
It's used to shave the top of the cylinder wall down (Ridge) removes the carbon buildup at the top of the wall to get the old piston out and also allow easy install of the piston so (Piston Rings) do not catch on it and break.
For any old school engine (it was a must have tool)

 

[dtech]

LOL, We ALL did! ( drive beaters...) the difference was they were easily repairable.

I rebuilt many an engine with no need for complex tools. I'd pull that Chevy small block V8, remove the cyinder ridge with a ridge remeamer, then mic and hone the cyinders, install new rings on the pistons, compress them, and reinstall them in the block with the wood handle of a hammer. I could have it rebuilt and up and running over a weekend. Maybe a couplel of more days if the crank needed turning and it had to go to the machine shop.

I used to adjust the voltage regulators as well, but I tended to go the other direction being south of Miami. I remember vacuum windshield wiper motors in my 55 Chevy (265 V8 in it). ! had electric when I upgraded to the 57 283 V8 Chevy.

I still miss the wing vent windows and bench seats. Cars were transportation, and a great place to spend time with your girl. Friday/Saturday nights at A & W getting a steak sandfwich, fries and cold root beer delivered to your window on a tray... Listening to 560 WQAM in Miami.

Good times!

I think I posted some yrs back had removed the rear driveshaft my 64 chevy biscayne - lost a few of the roller bearings from the u joint had a 1st date that night with a new gal and was running out of time so put the driveshaft back thinking it would be ok for while, picked her up and was driving when a small noise and vibration started to get progressively worse, went over bump, heard a noise and car quit accelerating, saw in the rear view mirror the driveshaft lying on the road, walked back and retrieved it called a friend for a ride and IIRC that was my 1st and last date with her, failing to make a good impression.

 

[IdahoRanger]

I think I posted some yrs back had removed the rear driveshaft my 64 chevy biscayne - lost a few of the roller bearings from the u joint had a 1st date that night with a new gal and was running out of time so put the driveshaft back thinking it would be ok for while, picked her up and was driving when a small noise and vibration started to get progressively worse, went over bump, heard a noise and car quit accelerating, saw in the rear view mirror the driveshaft lying on the road, walked back and retrieved it called a friend for a ride and IIRC that was my 1st and last date with her, failing to make a good impression.

I guess you got shafted.

 

[got3fords]

He meant to (TYPE) Ridge Reamer.
It's used to shave the top of the cylinder wall down (Ridge) removes the carbon buildup at the top of the wall to get the old piston out and also allow easy install of the piston so (Piston Rings) do not catch on it and break.
For any old school engine (it was a must have tool)

I thought it had to be something like that. But wasn't sure.

 

[TJC]

I thought it had to be something like that. But wasn't sure.

I am using an expensive narrow Das Keyboard brand keyboard. I spent 35 years on IBM standard size keyboards. It has affected my typing. I tend to go back over everything I type 3 or 4 times editing for typos. I did mean to type ridge reamer.

 

[Big Blue]

I have a couple questions for both @airline tech and @TJC How are you monitoring SOC, Charging amps and battery temps? Are you using Forscan or some other tester? Do you have the actual PID numbers for these values and the formulas?

I am asking because I have tracked down some numbers for other Ford vehicles and programmed them into my Torque Pro app. They appear to give valid values. I just want to see if they match up to what you are looking at. I have taken the time to fire up Forsan yet and compare my numbers to that. The weather has turned a bit cold here lately. We are at 4 degrees here right now and that looks to be our high today.

I have been following both of your excellent work on the BMS. I would like to monitor the battery numbers on my truck as I am sure many others would also. I'm not sure why these numbers need to be such a secret.

 

[TJC]

I am using 3 tools. I do use ForScan as well, just not as often.

• Scangauge 3 for realtime monitoring
  • Amperage (charging and discharging)
  • SOC
  • Voltage at the Battery
• A TopDon Model BT200 Battery Tester
  • This is a high quality tester that shows you everything the Viking does plus a whole lot more. I think it is more accurate as well.
• A Viking Battery Tester from your local Harbor Freight Store
  • An adequate tester that shows (it is a bit optimistic)
  • SOC
  • SOH
  • Measured CCA
  • Voltage
  • Internal Resistance

I also use a Batteryminder onboard desulfator ($52.79), easily installed then forget about it while it works its magic, a BatteryMinder 8amp Charger, and a CTEK 5 amp charger.
This is the best price I have ever seen for it, but I have never ordered from this company.

For battery temps hit it with a high quality infrared laser probe on the terminal. Then compare to ambient temp. I believe the temp is also available realtime via the BMS sensor ( Forscan, ScanGauge, and My xTools D8 Bidirectional Diagnostic Scan tool.

 

[airline tech]

For me - I am using my Autel MS906 PRO TS, for my drive tests, as it has the BT VCI.
I found that the 17 PIDs I monitor gives me a good overview of what is happening.
Forscan does not have the SOC Pid, but if you can find: Battery Voltage (Inferred) this is what the PCM is reading from the data communication of the BMS Sensor.
With the engine not running (charging), you can view the (Inferred-PID) and then use the SOC charts to calculate what the actual SOC (Estimated) is.
I would have to dig some to find all the (PCM/BCM) shortened PID names.
As the scan tools - decipher that for you

Ref: Post 740 for an example of what I am using
as far as testing (TopDon & Viking) Battery Testers

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