Stripped Transmission Pan Hole

[P. A. Schilke]

Thanks Dave, too many homes have cheap, pre-hung doors on inferior MDF jambs. They are way too easy to strip, especially if the drill clutch isn’t properly set.

Builders can save a lot on those doors, but in the end, quality matters. I see a lot of this in condos too. MDF baseboards, window trim, door casings, you name it. It’s too bad really.

Hi Duke,

When we built our custom home, we spec'd tile baseboards through out the house with exception of the bedrooms as they are carpet as tile is too cold on my poor feet. Then the trim guy Gilbert, a former tile guy started doing the trim. I looked at the first pre hung door ( which we changed to Southwest beadboard from six panel at a pricey cost). The trim job on this door was so bad I sent him home. He called the builder as did I and the builder arranged a meeting at the house where builder saw the lousy trim job, so I proposed that I do the trim and the pricey bead board extra cost would be waived. He, surprisingly, agreed and Gilbert was toast. I then spent quite a bit of time doing the trim, using MDF for baseboards but otherwise upgraded to wood from the builder's supplier...not stainable but paintable in wall color. So I trimmed our whole hose...Nice tight 45° miters etc. In the end, it was subtle and unappreciated by guests, but I know it was done right. I even had to reset some of the pre hung doors to level as Gilbert did his pre hung door with 8" long torpedo level, not a three foot maghonegy level with brass trim which I bought. Gilbert on his own showed up at the house and looked at what I did. He cast his eyes down and said he was going to sell his tools and go back to tile. I was sad as he just had to learn, and told him to come back after we moved in to the house. He did, examined the trim and I took him through where I had to reset the doors etc. He was crestfallen and I told him to practice and then I gave him the level I bought for the job as I did not have my tools with me, living in the RV park in our Alfa during the house build. Sent him off and hope the level has a happy life in his hands and him too. I also showed him how to use a T bevel which he did know existed... Hope he bought one!

Best,
Phil

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[DukeCanBuildit]

Hi Duke,

When we built our custom home, we spec'd tile baseboards through out the house with exception of the bedrooms as they are carpet as tile is too cold on my poor feet. Then the trim guy Gilbert, a former tile guy started doing the trim. I looked at the first pre hung door ( which we changed to Southwest beadboard from six panel at a pricey cost). The trim job on this door was so bad I sent him home. He called the builder as did I and the builder arranged a meeting at the house where builder saw the lousy trim job, so I proposed that I do the trim and the pricey bead board extra cost would be waived. He, surprisingly, agreed and Gilbert was toast. I then spent quite a bit of time doing the trim, using MDF for baseboards but otherwise upgraded to wood from the builder's supplier...not stainable but paintable in wall color. So I trimmed our whole hose...Nice tight 45° miters etc. In the end, it was subtle and unappreciated by guests, but I know it was done right. I even had to reset some of the pre hung doors to level as Gilbert did his pre hung door with 8" long torpedo level, not a three foot maghonegy level with brass trim which I bought. Gilbert on his own showed up at the house and looked at what I did. He cast his eyes down and said he was going to sell his tools and go back to tile. I was sad as he just had to learn, and told him to come back after we moved in to the house. He did, examined the trim and I took him through where I had to reset the doors etc. He was crestfallen and I told him to practice and then I gave him the level I bought for the job as I did not have my tools with me, living in the RV park in our Alfa during the house build. Sent him off and hope the level has a happy life in his hands and him too. I also showed him how to use a T bevel which he did know existed... Hope he bought one!

Best,
Phil

Quality millwork and other finish carpentry takes practice and the end result can be incredibly rewarding. There are a lot of tips and tricks that are learned along the way. I think about the craftsmanship in that level you gave him and hope that every time he looks at it, he is inspired to get better and better. ?

 

[chrisakz]

I wouldn't use the 8 -10 ft/lbs in their online instructions either. I would use the shop manual specs.

To be fair 9 lb/ft is equal to 108 lb/in. Take your lb/ft number and times it by 12 to get your lb/in number. And yes it’s more accurate but I’ve swapped them around when I didn’t have the other handy

 

[RangerBill]

To be fair 9 lb/ft is equal to 108 lb/in. Take your lb/ft number and times it by 12 to get your lb/in number. And yes it’s more accurate but I’ve swapped them around when I didn’t have the other handy

But the 89 lb.in for the pan bolts is equivalent to 7.42 ft/lbs. That is quite a difference if you use the 10 ft/lbs at such a low torque setting. Why chance it?

 

[Dereku]

Thanks Dave, too many homes have cheap, pre-hung doors on inferior MDF jambs. They are way too easy to strip, especially if the drill clutch isn’t properly set.

Builders can save a lot on those doors, but in the end, quality matters. I see a lot of this in condos too. MDF baseboards, window trim, door casings, you name it. It’s too bad really.

MDF is garbage. Cant even cope a good corner on trim. It falls apart. Pine trim all the way.

 

[AzScorpion]

MDF is garbage. Cant even cope a good corner on trim. It falls apart. Pine trim all the way.

No one uses much (if at all) pine trim in the past 10-15 years. Unless they're doing custom trim it's all been MDF and finger jointed pine. It was so bad during the building boom in the mid 90's the FJP was showing almost every joint once we painted it.

 

[chrisakz]

But the 89 lb.in for the pan bolts is equivalent to 7.42 ft/lbs. That is quite a difference if you use the 10 ft/lbs at such a low torque setting. Why chance it?

I’m sure 10 is a safe number for an M6 bolt. If given the option is always go in the middle. Remember also the OEM pan is made of plastic and aftermarket is made from cast aluminum so those are instructions for installing an OEM pan.

 

[RangerBill]

I’m sure 10 is a safe number for an M6 bolt. If given the option is always go in the middle. Remember also the OEM pan is made of plastic and aftermarket is made from cast aluminum so those are instructions for installing an OEM pan.

To each his own, I wouldn't chance it, if it were me.

 

[P. A. Schilke]

To be fair 9 lb/ft is equal to 108 lb/in. Take your lb/ft number and times it by 12 to get your lb/in number. And yes it’s more accurate but I’ve swapped them around when I didn’t have the other handy

Hi Chris,

I lost my in-lbs torque wrench in the move from Michigan to Arizona. Infrequently used so I never replaced but maybe some day, just because I am a Toolaholic.

Back story. Before rack and pinion steering gears, Ford had a steering gear called the XR50 powersteering gear. This cast iron gear was used in most Ford truck products from the F450/E450 down to the lowly Ranger twin I beam before the UPN105 program and SLA front suspension and rack and pinion steering. Heavy and yet not robust enough for E450 Ambulance package commercial use, so the Recirculating Ball, worm and sector shaft was modified for that package to install the largest sector shaft that could be packaged into the XR50 gear. The splined end of the sector shaft is where the Pitman Arm was attached which swept the arc through tie rods to the spindle steering arms. Okay so the XR50 gear worn gear this to end attached to the steering wheel had a High Spot on it that was half way to the left or right turning of the steering wheel. It was to keep the straight ahead feel solid by having an almost interterence mesh of worm gear to sector shaft. (okay...with me?). This high spot proved to be undone after the fact by alignment business and dealers when they realigned a truck.

We had this process called centering the gear so the steering wheel would be straight during straight ahead driving. So how did this "sweet spot" get determined? It was done by disconnecting the steering linkage from the pitman arm and after removing the steering wheel, an adapter to the top of the steering column where an dial inch pound torque wrench was attached. The wrench was cycled from left lock to right lock and the highest number was noted. Then cycled Right to Left and again the highest inch lb number was recorded. Now we had the "center" id'ed and then turned the gear to the "center"....Then reinstalled the steering wheel straight. Then with the wheel held straight, the alignment was redone. This almost always fixed complaints of pull to the right or left when driving straight ahead. But...what a complicated process at that time and most dealers and alignment shops did not get it.

Best,
Phil

 

[chrisakz]

I don’t think anyone like losing a tool, I know the feeling of wanting to have a tool just incase I might need it even if I don’t need it. Never know what you might run in to. Interesting Phil. So the “feel” of center and the “actual” center of lock to lock could be different for better driving experience? I imagine the left-right ratio would be affected by such, perhaps very minimally.

 

[Dereku]

No one uses much (if at all) pine trim in the past 10-15 years. Unless they're doing custom trim it's all been MDF and finger jointed pine. It was so bad during the building boom in the mid 90's the FJP was showing almost every joint once we painted it.

I'll accept properly sanded FJP over MDF. My house is 8 years old and all painted pine. No im not rich either.

 

[Joeiconic]

Here’s a tip to take the “toothpicks in the door hinge hole” trick to a new level….

Drill 3/8” holes into the door jamb where the stripped screw holes are.
Squirt some wood glue in there - spread it around with an awl or screwdriver.
Spread some wood glue on the end of 3/8” wood dowel.
Insert the dowel as far as it will go.
Cut dowel off flush to the jamb with an oscillating tool or other fine saw.
Repeat for the remaining holes.
Let the glue dry for several hours.
Drill 1/8” pilot holes in the centre of the dowel ends.
Mount the door, using door hinge screws.

? ? ?‍

yep, Ive done the dowel trick on door hinges and the toothpick trick on cabinet hinges. If you‘re in a hurry, simply using a longer and/or fatter screw works most of the time in wood material. Door hinge screws are usually quite short actually. On exterior doors I replace them with 2.5-3 inch screws for security reasons. It makes it harder to kick a door in.

 

[JoeyRig]

So I've done a little digging on threaded inserts and I'm torn between the keyed inserts and timeserts. If this was my old busted 2003 F150 Triton I would probably just dp the ziptie trick and be happy, but I want to be a little more cautious with my Ranger.

Keyed Inserts:

PROS:
-Available from Mcmaster, all I'd need is a setting tool. Have a bit set with proper sized bits (8.8) and the tap size (M10 × 1.25)
-Seem to be the ideal permanent solution for Aluminum
- Keys keep insert in place and prevent backing out

CONS:
-Need the room for a large new insert. Theres about 1/8 of an inch of meat, but I'd only expand the radius by ~5/64

Timeserts:

PROS:
- Couldn't find data on how much room I need but supposedly less because the inner and outer threads are nestled
- Shouldered for easy depth control
- Expands into threads to prevent backing out

CONS:
- Need to find a quick shipping source for them
- Need to buy whole kit ($)
- Online reviews are either a love hate and people claim that they rip out easy

Or I take the seemingly overwhelming advice and just run Helicoils but I'd need to get over my own issue with them which is they always seem to spin out with the bolt.

At an impasse here and can't make a decision. Want to make good and sure that I only have to drill holes in my near new transmission once!

Thank you.

 

[JoeyRig]

Next time just go German spec!!

Guten teit was what my heart was saying, Frenchy, but I'm also a sucker for torque specs! ?

 

[Grumpaw]

So I've done a little digging on threaded inserts and I'm torn between the keyed inserts and timeserts. If this was my old busted 2003 F150 Triton I would probably just dp the ziptie trick and be happy, but I want to be a little more cautious with my Ranger.

Keyed Inserts:

PROS:
-Available from Mcmaster, all I'd need is a setting tool. Have a bit set with proper sized bits (8.8) and the tap size (M10 × 1.25)
-Seem to be the ideal permanent solution for Aluminum
- Keys keep insert in place and prevent backing out

CONS:
-Need the room for a large new insert. Theres about 1/8 of an inch of meat, but I'd only expand the radius by ~5/64

Timeserts:

PROS:
- Couldn't find data on how much room I need but supposedly less because the inner and outer threads are nestled
- Shouldered for easy depth control
- Expands into threads to prevent backing out

CONS:
- Need to find a quick shipping source for them
- Need to buy whole kit ($)
- Online reviews are either a love hate and people claim that they rip out easy

Or I take the seemingly overwhelming advice and just run Helicoils but I'd need to get over my own issue with them which is they always seem to spin out with the bolt.

At an impasse here and can't make a decision. Want to make good and sure that I only have to drill holes in my near new transmission once!

Thank you.

Several years back I had a small MC parts and repair shop with a partner (post retirement from a PO).
Can't tell you how many Harleys we repaired...the access engine covers, with heli coils. The 1/4-20 factory bolts were only supposed to be snugged down, but many owners would really torque them down and they would strip VERY easily. We would simply repair them with 1/4-20 heli coils, and would never have one come out with the bolt due to the low inch/lb that they were properly snugged down too.
What I'm getting at is that with the low inch/lb that the trans bolt should be properly torqued down to, I doubt the heli coil will come out with the bolt in future removals. The simple trick is to make sure the DRY heli coil is being threaded into a DRY repaired hole....no lube, but you can use a light coat...just a dab, of thread locker on the OUTER THREADS

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