Help with towing numbers

[JimJa]

From the NHTSA:
Because tires are designed to be used on more than one type of vehicle, tire manufacturers list the “maximum permissible inflation pressure” on the tire sidewall. This number is the greatest amount of air pressure that should ever be put in the tire under normal driving conditions.

My father and my grandfather before him were in the tire business. I grew up around it so I'd like to believe I have a little bit of knowledge. NHTSA, just like the tire mfg'er, has to "cover their six" and do not want to face repercussions of saying it's okay to inflate above the sidewall label and have some person run over a sharp object, have a blowout and sue, and we most certainly are a litigious society. As a kid growing up in farm country it was not unusual for farmers to take an old worn out bias belt tube tire with a "boot" covering a large cut in the sidewall and inflating it to 90PSI for use on a hay wagon. Today's tires are MUCH better than tires of old and I'd have no fear inflating a tire on my truck above the max sidewall label.

The biggest enemy of any tire is heat. An underinflated tire gets a lot hotter than an overinflated tire and is much more in danger of catastrophic failure.

Just trying to provide some knowledge and information. Am in NO way telling people what to do or not to do when it comes to tires on their vehicle. Do whatever you are comfortable with WRT tire pressure.

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[HAMMERTIME]

I have an XLT with the factory tow package. I pull a 21 ft Starcraft TT with a Husky WDH and friction sway. There is some sway when large trucks pass on a windy day but if you don`t react to the wind pressure, it will continue straight down the road. As a 40 year transport driver, I am used to some vehicle movement with wind when pulling a trailer. That said, it is critical you have the set up correct. On a level surface, measure your truck from the ground to the edge of the wheel well at all 4 wheels. then with your trailer level measure from ground to the top of the ball hitch. Hook to the trailer without load bars and re-measure all 5 spots. Next, connect the bars and bring the truck as close to the original measurements as you can. Both truck and trailer should be very close to level with the trailer attached properly. Too much sag in the rear or front of the truck will effect how it pulls down the road. If you need more help, PM me and I can explain further. Good luck.

 

[J Krutsch]

I have a 2020 Lariat with tow package and dealer installed Redarc brake controller. Planning to tow a Grand Designs Imagine 17 MKE (see attached sticker). I know I need to go the scales but just wanted everyone's opinion so as to make this as safe as possible. I have an Eaz-Lift Elite weight distribution hitch with a friction-type sway controller. I had a smaller camper that the WDH came off of and wondering if I need to upgrade to a better hitch with a better sway control system. When towing the new camper home it did seem to wobble somewhat, but only pulled it like 5 miles on the highway. Also considering adding a sway bar - recommendations? Ranger tires are Hancook Dynapro ATM (51 max psi) - I had them at 45 psi when towing. I've also attached a spreadsheet containing the weights of the Ranger and camper. Comments please!!!

I've pulled a Grand Design 18 RBE about 4000 miles now. Yes, it started out a bit squishy. Have an E2 WDH that works well. Replacing the stock shocks with Bilstein made a world of difference. The Hancook Dynapro tires are crap IMO. To fully get rid of the wobble I have to run them at 50 lbs. I have Les Schwab Observe snow tires on it right now and there is no wobble at 35 lbs. When it is time for summer tires again I am going to pitch the Hancooks and get something good so I don't have to continue to air them up and down.

 

[J Krutsch]

Curious, What are you using for rear view mirrors? Can you see good with the stock mirrors?

The stock mirrors don't work with a big trailer. I do not like the clip on ones as they vibrate too much. I really like the door mount ones, stable and they stick out beyond the stock mirror so all the sensors continue to work.
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[Rviator]

My father and my grandfather before him were in the tire business. I grew up around it so I'd like to believe I have a little bit of knowledge. NHTSA, just like the tire mfg'er, has to "cover their six" and do not want to face repercussions of saying it's okay to inflate above the sidewall label and have some person run over a sharp object, have a blowout and sue, and we most certainly are a litigious society. As a kid growing up in farm country it was not unusual for farmers to take an old worn out bias belt tube tire with a "boot" covering a large cut in the sidewall and inflating it to 90PSI for use on a hay wagon. Today's tires are MUCH better than tires of old and I'd have no fear inflating a tire on my truck above the max sidewall label.

The biggest enemy of any tire is heat. An underinflated tire gets a lot hotter than an overinflated tire and is much more in danger of catastrophic failure.

Just trying to provide some knowledge and information. Am in NO way telling people what to do or not to do when it comes to tires on their vehicle. Do whatever you are comfortable with WRT tire pressure.

Having a little bit of knowledge can be a dangerous thing. As someone once said; you don't know what you don't know.
All tires can heat up during use which is why the tire sidewall is max cold inflation pressure. Cold inflation pressure is with tires at ambient temperature (surrounding air temp).

 

[Walkeraviator]

A bit late the the conversation, but I haul the 21BHE with my Ranger. Same GVWR as yours, but I’ve never come close to that number. I use the equalizer hitch and still get some side to side motion in gusty crosswinds and when trucks pass. It demands your attention, but never gets out of control. Anything short of a Hensley design is going allow lateral movement at the hitch point.

I also feel the bouncy suspension issue when loaded. It’s obnoxious. If I opt to keep this truck (highly dependent on long range gas tank avilability), I am gonna do eibach shocks and upgrade to e load tires.

I am considering going to a bigger truck simply so I have enough payload and back seat room for the whole family to ride in the truck. For now, wife and three kids drive separate.

 

[ArkyRanger]

A bit late the the conversation, but I haul the 21BHE with my Ranger. Same GVWR as yours, but I’ve never come close to that number. I use the equalizer hitch and still get some side to side motion in gusty crosswinds and when trucks pass. It demands your attention, but never gets out of control. Anything short of a Hensley design is going allow lateral movement at the hitch point.

I also feel the bouncy suspension issue when loaded. It’s obnoxious. If I opt to keep this truck (highly dependent on long range gas tank avilability), I am gonna do eibach shocks and upgrade to e load tires.

I am considering going to a bigger truck simply so I have enough payload and back seat room for the whole family to ride in the truck. For now, wife and three kids drive separate.

Thanks for the reply, yes your camper is very similar to my 17MKE. My Ranger pulls mine great but as you said, windy conditions make for some two-handed driving. I would love to hear how your proposed mods help with the "swaying". I have considered adding an anti-sway bar but need to investigate further...

 

[ArkyRanger]

Thanks for the reply, yes your camper is very similar to my 17MKE. My Ranger pulls mine great but as you said, windy conditions make for some two-handed driving. I would love to hear how your proposed mods help with the "swaying". I have considered adding an anti-sway bar but need to investigate further...

So far the mods that I have made specifically for towing has really helped. They are as follows: Ford Performance Tuner, Hellwig anti-sway bar, Eibach rear shocks (one side only - waiting on a second one), brake controller, Reese Steadi-flex weight distribution hitch and I also inflate my rear tires to 45 psi. The stock mirrors are not adequate for towing, I have some clamp-on ones that seem to work OK.

As some of the others have said, try to keep your speed to around 60, as the truck seems to "sway" more at about 65. A friend had some good advise by saying "you don't always have to be the first one to the campground you know".

 

[JCMAC]

Lol so the Firestone/Ford scandal you are talking about was with the lovely Exploders. I am very aware of that and how Ford messed up. It started with Ford lowering the tire PSI from the original setup because people were being stupid and tipping the SUV. Once they did that the tires were exploding making the SUV loose control and possibly flip. Is that a Firestone issue? No that is a Ford issue there. Also i can say with experience of my truck and other vehicles that i have not needed to increase the amount of air in the tire just for towing a trailer. When I towed my 280ZX on the Uhaul auto transport I keep the tires at 30 psi and it did just fine.

 

[JCMAC]

As a former Explorer owner I recall the Firestone problem, it was ultimately found that Bridgestone/Firestone made defective tires. Documented reports were that Ford shipped a sizeable batch of Goodyear equipped Explorers (many thousands) and did not experience any tire failures with them. The only difference was the tires. It was also reported that Birdgestone/Firestone reduced the vulcanization time for curing the rubber in an attempt to speed up production which as we know did not end well. With the defective tires at high ambient temperatures, high road speed, high loads and lower than recommended tire pressures proved to be problematical.

 

[P. A. Schilke]

As a former Explorer owner I recall the Firestone problem, it was ultimately found that Bridgestone/Firestone made defective tires. Documented reports were that Ford shipped a sizeable batch of Goodyear equipped Explorers (many thousands) and did not experience any tire failures with them. The only difference was the tires. It was also reported that Birdgestone/Firestone reduced the vulcanization time for curing the rubber in an attempt to speed up production which as we know did not end well. With the defective tires at high ambient temperatures, high road speed, high loads and lower than recommended tire pressures proved to be problematical.

There are many more aspects to this problem in which I was embroiled..Frenchy detailed one aspect, but it was a minor contributor. Tires from Aiken SC were just fine...an automated process...those from Georgia plant were hand laid up and problematic... Ford screwed up and Firestone screwed up.. The big problem was our POS CEO Jaques Nassar and John Lampe of Firestone Egos resulting in a total fiasco.. Both were removed from office as I recall....We celebrated Nassar's ousting...Total Ego Jerk. I have no kind words for him...he did nothing to better Ford on his watch.

 

[Gil-galad]

So far the mods that I have made specifically for towing has really helped. They are as follows: Ford Performance Tuner, Hellwig anti-sway bar, Eibach rear shocks (one side only - waiting on a second one), brake controller, Reese Steadi-flex weight distribution hitch and I also inflate my rear tires to 45 psi. The stock mirrors are not adequate for towing, I have some clamp-on ones that seem to work OK.

I am closely following your experience and mods. I have a 2021 Lariat 4x4 with factory tow package and dealer-installed brake controller. I recently returned from a 3000 mile trip towing a 20 ft R-Pod RP-179 (3500 lb wet, 600 lb tongue weight) on a Curt WDH with friction anti-sway. With the single axle trailer, I expected to feel a bit of "squirminess" in crosswinds and while being passed by semis but frankly, it was a bit more prevalent than I had anticipated and similar to what we experience in our SUV with less towing capacity and shorter wheel base. I could feel a bit of squirrelly buffeting from the turbulence behind a truck on the highway, even with a sizable 100 yard following distance.

The worst part was the brutal and bouncy response of the rear when hitting road imperfections like bridge approaches. I actually got into the habit of warning my napping spouse when spotting a likely bump ahead so she wouldn't knock out her fillings. It felt like a speedboat crossing the wake of another boat. This is something I really need to remedy in order to be happy with the truck.

I should add my OEM tires are Bridgestone Dueller A/T 255/65R-17 (max load 51 psi). Interestingly, the door jam sticker recommends 30 psi at all four corners. I ran the tires at 31 psi cold pressure throughout our trip. Even with the truck and trailer level and the WDH properly loaded, the rear tires were visibly squatting more than the fronts. Using the vehicle display, I also noticed the running psi of the rear tires would increase by 5 psi while the fronts would only increase 1 or 2 psi.

I'm thinking my first action may be to bump up the tire pressures while towing, maybe start out at 36 psi and see what happens. I also have my eye on the Hellwig RSB and Eibachs in the rear. I'd welcome recommendations on prioritizing these mods.

 

[Big Blue]

I am closely following your experience and mods. I have a 2021 Lariat 4x4 with factory tow package and dealer-installed brake controller. I recently returned from a 3000 mile trip towing a 20 ft R-Pod RP-179 (3500 lb wet, 600 lb tongue weight) on a Curt WDH with friction anti-sway. With the single axle trailer, I expected to feel a bit of "squirminess" in crosswinds and while being passed by semis but frankly, it was a bit more prevalent than I had anticipated and similar to what we experience in our SUV with less towing capacity and shorter wheel base. I could feel a bit of squirrelly buffeting from the turbulence behind a truck on the highway, even with a sizable 100 yard following distance.

The worst part was the brutal and bouncy response of the rear when hitting road imperfections like bridge approaches. I actually got into the habit of warning my napping spouse when spotting a likely bump ahead so she wouldn't knock out her fillings. It felt like a speedboat crossing the wake of another boat. This is something I really need to remedy in order to be happy with the truck.

I should add my OEM tires are Bridgestone Dueller A/T 255/65R-17 (max load 51 psi). Interestingly, the door jam sticker recommends 30 psi at all four corners. I ran the tires at 31 psi cold pressure throughout our trip. Even with the truck and trailer level and the WDH properly loaded, the rear tires were visibly squatting more than the fronts. Using the vehicle display, I also noticed the running psi of the rear tires would increase by 5 psi while the fronts would only increase 1 or 2 psi.

I'm thinking my first action may be to bump up the tire pressures while towing, maybe start out at 36 psi and see what happens. I also have my eye on the Hellwig RSB and Eibachs in the rear. I'd welcome recommendations on prioritizing these mods.

I pull a RPod 191 with my 2019 XLT FX4. A liitle bigger than your but not much. Runs about 4200 wet with 450 to 500 tongue weight. I run a Husky Centerline WDH with built in sway control. Did a 4700 mile trip this spring out west and back. Zero issues. I did run 35 psi from and 42 psi back. Have Bilstein 5100 rear shocks. Felt the cross winds and semis, but zero sway. Stayed 70 mph or less, any more really kills the mileage.

My suggestions are definitely raise the tire pressures. Next, rear shocks, it will help the ride not towing also. I would try rebalancing the trailer to lower the tongue weight a little, get it between 10 and 15 percent of trailer weight. That will get some extra weight off the back of the truck.

One last comment, this my opinion only. I am not a fan of friction sway bars. It is hard to consistently adjust them and they need to be disconnected when backing.

 

[Gil-galad]

I pull a RPod 191 with my 2019 XLT FX4. A liitle bigger than your but not much. Runs about 4200 wet with 450 to 500 tongue weight. I run a Husky Centerline WDH with built in sway control. Did a 4700 mile trip this spring out west and back. Zero issues. I did run 35 psi from and 42 psi back. Have Bilstein 5100 rear shocks. Felt the cross winds and semis, but zero sway. Stayed 70 mph or less, any more really kills the mileage.

What brand/size of tires are you running? What does the door jam card on your FX4 recommend for tire pressures?

I should also mention the estimated 600 lb tongue weight is prior to tensioning the WDH. I think the hitch brings this down by ~100 lb.

 

[Big Blue]

What brand/size of tires are you running? What does the door jam card on your FX4 recommend for tire pressures?

I should also mention the estimated 600 lb tongue weight is prior to tensioning the WDH. I think the hitch brings this down by ~100 lb.

My tires are LT265-65-17 Hancooks, sticker says 38 psi i normally run at 34 psi.

Tongue weight is tongue weight as far as the trailer is concerned. The WDH only adjusts how it is distributed on the truck.

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