8492 - 2019 Ranger - Trailer Brake Controller Availability

[RangerJeff]

automatic emergency braking

since ford hasn't been clear about what the problem is...¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I know it’s automatic emergency braking, but what exactly does that mean, what are the parameters for it to be activated? What does the brake controller actually have to do with that system?

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[MT19RANGER]

I know it’s automatic emergency braking, but what exactly does that mean, what are the parameters for it to be activated? What does the brake controller actually have to do with that system?

https://www.ford.com/technology/driver-assist-technology/pre-collision-assist/
See the owners manual too...
https://www.ranger5g.com/forum/thre...-guide-packaging-guide.1071/page-2#post-32492 current version 3.0

We've had discussions here too that might help.

https://www.ranger5g.com/forum/threads/pre-collision-assist.3239/

 

[tivct]

When Ford says a brake controller can't be used with emergency braking, it means when the emergency braking system requests a braking event, it only requests ABS pressure to the truck's wheels, and will not request trailer brake activation as well. So, braking performance won't be adequate (although it will still be there/help.)

Brake controller activation is based on pedal input, which is absent during emergency braking assistance (until you press the pedal)

 

[VAMike]

When Ford says a brake controller can't be used with emergency braking, it means when the emergency braking system requests a braking event, it only requests ABS pressure to the truck's wheels, and will not request trailer brake activation as well. So, braking performance won't be adequate (although it will still be there/help.)

Brake controller activation is based on pedal input, which is absent during emergency braking assistance (until you press the pedal)

Is that a theory or can you reference documentation of that from Ford?

 

[tivct]

Is that a theory or can you reference documentation of that from Ford?

I guess you could say I have immediate familiarity with this stuff... but can't share internal documentation, sorry.

 

[VAMike]

I guess you could say I have immediate familiarity with this stuff... but can't share internal documentation, sorry.

The trouble is there have been a lot of theories about what that obscure line in the manual means, and no real evidence to support any of them.

 

[tivct]

The trouble is there have been a lot of theories about what that obscure line in the manual means, and no real evidence to support any of them.

Yes, but the other people with those theories aren't Ford engineers who work on driver assist technologies, among other things

EDIT: I should clarify, adaptive cruise works with Super Duty & F150 brake controllers, because they are integrated, and communicate through the vehicle CAN network (on the latest 2018+ models.) The Ranger does not have this feature.

 

[VAMike]

Yes, but the other people with those theories aren't Ford engineers who work on driver assist technologies, among other things

On the internet, nobody knows you're a dog.

EDIT: I should clarify, adaptive cruise works with Super Duty & F150 brake controllers, because they are integrated, and communicate through the vehicle CAN network (on the latest 2018+ models.) The Ranger does not have this feature.

Are we talking about adaptive cruise or AEB?

At any rate, if the entire issue was that AEB wouldn't necessarily apply enough force to stop the truck, many people might say "well, most trucks/my last truck don't AEB at all, so there's no real loss of functionality and no real issue with using a TBC with the ranger". But then someone else comes along with a different theory that suggests using a TBC with a ranger will cause you to explode and go to hell. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

The same general arguments apply to adaptive cruise.

 

[tivct]

On the internet, nobody knows you're a dog.


Are we talking about adaptive cruise or AEB?

At any rate, if the entire issue was that AEB wouldn't necessarily apply enough force to stop the truck, many people might say "well, most trucks/my last truck don't AEB at all, so there's no real loss of functionality and no real issue with using a TBC with the ranger". But then someone else comes along with a different theory that suggests using a TBC with a ranger will cause you to explode and go to hell. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

The same general arguments apply to adaptive cruise.

Both ACC and AEB will underperform in the Ranger while towing, compared to the other '18+ trucks, which will engage trailer brakes for both features. Nothing is broken, but Ford includes that language so you don't expect ACC & AEB to account for your trailer.

 

[VAMike]

Both ACC and AEB will underperform in the Ranger while towing, compared to the other '18+ trucks, which will engage trailer brakes for both features. Nothing is broken, but Ford includes that language so you don't expect ACC & AEB to account for your trailer.

To clarify, the manual doesn't say "won't account for your trailer", what it says about ACC is "Do not use the system
when towing a trailer that has aftermarket electronic trailer brake controls. Failure to follow this instruction could result in the loss of control of your vehicle, personal injury or death." Nothing about what, specifically, the problem is, or how it might kill you. (Of course the manual also talks about trailer backup assist and other things that don't even exist on the ranger, so it isn't clear how accurate any of it is.) The TSB says "Do not tow trailers equipped with electric brakes without a compatible trailer brake controller", it says nothing about "go ahead and tow but AEB won't work very well". My personal feeling is that the ranger will work just like any truck did before AEB and ACC were invented if you use a brake controller, but there's nothing from Ford beyond vague threats of death. I can certainly understand how some people might be really pissed that Ford sold a truck with class-leading towing but then told them that trying to tow something might kill them unless they have an optional part that doesn't even exist.

It's also worth pointing out that the J2807 towing test includes a simulated trailer brake failure at full load, because if the TBC doesn't activate the brakes the truck is not actually supposed to kill you, just take longer to stop. If Ford just said "aftermarket TBC will not activate for AEB and ACC" that would be understandable. What they actually wrote is not.

 

[DrRoger]

When Ford says a brake controller can't be used with emergency braking, it means when the emergency braking system requests a braking event, it only requests ABS pressure to the truck's wheels, and will not request trailer brake activation as well. So, braking performance won't be adequate (although it will still be there/help.)

Brake controller activation is based on pedal input, which is absent during emergency braking assistance (until you press the pedal)

When ABS is activated, do the brake lights come ON?

 

[dmeyer302]

When ABS is activated, do the brake lights come ON?

^this. As long as my brake controller (Redarc) gets that brake light signal, I can’t figure out how it would know the difference whether I am pressing the brake or the auto system is doing it. It will continue to function normally.

 

[VAMike]

^this. As long as my brake controller (Redarc) gets that brake light signal, I can’t figure out how it would know the difference whether I am pressing the brake or the auto system is doing it. It will continue to function normally.

well, that would really depend on whether the "brake active" wire you plugged into your redarc is connected to the taillights or the brake pedal, right?

 

[dmeyer302]

well, that would really depend on whether the "brake active" wire you plugged into your redarc is connected to the taillights or the brake pedal, right?

I used the factory harness. Not sure of its behavior.

 

[t4thfavor]

I guess you could say I have immediate familiarity with this stuff... but can't share internal documentation, sorry.

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