Spacers plus aftermarket crash bar = ?

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ahha

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One thing to keep in mind regarding crash bars, a stronger design may not mean a better design. You want the materials to absorb as much of the energy from a crash as possible. If your super strong crash bar snaps off the bracketry that's holding it, that is not a better design.

There's no substitute for actual crash testing.

The other unknown is one would think a wider tire would do less intrusion into the cab than a stock narrow tire.

Again, no substitute for actual crash testing.
Understood about actual crash testing being the best, thanks for making the point about the variables.

All that being said above, is there a consensus about installing aftermarket crash bars being more risky than other modifications? Lifting a truck 6” and moving it’s center of gravity higher certainly increases risk, seems like all suspension modifications carry some risk. So where do aftermarket crash bars sit on the risk scale?





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Understood about actual crash testing being the best, thanks for making the point about the variables.

All that being said above, is there a consensus about installing aftermarket crash bars being more risky than other modifications? Lifting a truck 6” and moving it’s center of gravity higher certainly increases risk, seems like all suspension modifications carry some risk. So where do aftermarket crash bars sit on the risk scale?

Well, since they were designed to specifically keep front seat occupants feet / legs from getting damaged in an accident.. it's a personal decision. Talk it over with your prospective front seat passengers, let them make the call.

The older you get... the more you think about this kind of stuff....
 
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Well, since they were designed to specifically keep front seat occupants feet / legs from getting damaged in an accident.. it's a personal decision. Talk it over with your prospective front seat passengers, let them make the call.

The older you get... the more you think about this kind of stuff....
I’m 56 and never been involved in a non motorcycle bodily injury claim and used to drive a straight truck for a living. I have thought about safety often, and I doubt the crash bars are the only thing stopping a front wheel from being pushed into the cabin. For starters, IFS has more mounting points than a solid axel and probably has a better chance of staying put in a collision. So no, I don’t feel the need to have a conversation with my passengers about small modifications.
 
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Anybody else care to weigh in on the dangers of aftermarket crash bars?
 

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Anybody else care to weigh in on the dangers of aftermarket crash bars?
Untested. Crash pulse affect unknown. Occupant injury criteria unknown.
 

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Anybody else care to weigh in on the dangers of aftermarket crash bars?
Only to say that if an aftermarket anti-intrusion beam manufacturer knew their product was as effective as, or more effective than, the OEM component, they would be sure to say so. Instead, they use carefully selected language that talks about the material they use meeting the same specs as OEM - it might be as strong as but does it perform the same or better.

With that said, I have the ReadyLIFT anti-intrusion beams on my truck - even after seeing how FEA testing models that showed they would fail sooner than OEM in a simulated impact.

Basically…..

FAFDC45F-7E60-44CE-A6FC-22E50C1DCBA2.png
 

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Has anyone considered the insurance company’s point of view on the crash bar discussion. Will adding aftermarket crash bars effect your ability to file a claim should the unthinkable happen?
My two cents….
 
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Untested. Crash pulse affect unknown. Occupant injury criteria unknown.
Fair enough, Phil. Can you explain what “crash pulse affect” is? I can guess, but would rather hear your explanation.
 
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Only to say that if an aftermarket anti-intrusion beam manufacturer knew their product was as effective as, or more effective than, the OEM component, they would be sure to say so. Instead, they use carefully selected language that talks about the material they use meeting the same specs as OEM - it might be as strong as but does it perform the same or better.

With that said, I have the ReadyLIFT anti-intrusion beams on my truck - even after seeing how FEA testing models that showed they would fail sooner than OEM in a simulated impact.

Basically…..

FAFDC45F-7E60-44CE-A6FC-22E50C1DCBA2.png
Thanks for your input, what FEA?
 

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Thanks for your input, what FEA?
Finite Element Analysis (FEA)
A computerized method for predicting how a product reacts to real-world forces, vibration, heat, fluid flow, and other physical effects. Finite element analysis shows whether a product will break, wear out, or work the way it was designed.

Basically, a computer simulation of the component under impact but unlike crash-testing, there is no information on occupant injury.
 

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Has anyone considered the insurance company’s point of view on the crash bar discussion. Will adding aftermarket crash bars effect your ability to file a claim should the unthinkable happen?
My two cents….
More likely an issue for those that simply remove the existing crash bars without replacing them. Kind of like removing a supplemental restraint device, like seat belts or an air bag, but to a lesser degree.

If you replace the intrusion beams with aftermarket units that fail and cause a personal injury, then it would fall back to the manufacturer of the aftermarket beams.
 

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Finite Element Analysis (FEA)
A computerized method for predicting how a product reacts to real-world forces, vibration, heat, fluid flow, and other physical effects. Finite element analysis shows whether a product will break, wear out, or work the way it was designed.

Basically, a computer simulation of the component under impact but unlike crash-testing, there is no information on occupant injury.
@ahha

Duke was kind enough to provide me with some dimensional data on the aftermarket intrusion beams he used. I ran some rudimentary FEA on them. IMO the aftermarket beams are not as strong as the OEM beams.

What does that mean? Impossible to say without crash testing.

If you watch the offset crash test videos, the tire blows out and the wheel is driven backwards and impacts the cab in the footwell area. That's where front seat occupants feet would be. Here's a link: Ford Ranger 2019 | Crash Tests


But all you really need to understand is Ford wouldn't have spent the time and money developing these, if they were not needed.

Stock Front Intrusion Beam 3K Load.JPG
Aftermarket Front Intrusion Beam 3K Load.JPG
Stock Rear Intrusion Beam 3K Load.JPG
Aftermarket Rear Intrusion Beam 3K Load Corrected.JPG
 
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Fair enough, Phil. Can you explain what “crash pulse affect” is? I can guess, but would rather hear your explanation.
Hi Andrew, The crash event is nonlinear and takes very sophisticated software for analysis..it is a sort of FEA as it uses the same models. The "pulse" is like a heavy weight prize fighter delivering your body a might blow...all over in a milisecond or so... This pulse can be minimized to a degree by deformation of the truck's structure which softens the blow so to speak. Make sense?

Best,
Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retired
 

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Hi Andrew, The crash event is nonlinear and takes very sophisticated software for analysis..it is a sort of FEA as it uses the same models. The "pulse" is like a heavy weight prize fighter delivering your body a might blow...all over in a milisecond or so... This pulse can be minimized to a degree by deformation of the truck's structure which softens the blow so to speak. Make sense?

Best,
Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retired
It’s a bit like the Bruce Lee 6” punch - find it on YouTube and you’ll know what I mean.
 
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@ahha

Duke was kind enough to provide me with some dimensional data on the aftermarket intrusion beams he used. I ran some rudimentary FEA on them. IMO the aftermarket beams are not as strong as the OEM beams.

What does that mean? Impossible to say without crash testing.

If you watch the offset crash test videos, the tire blows out and the wheel is driven backwards and impacts the cab in the footwell area. That's where front seat occupants feet would be. Here's a link: Ford Ranger 2019 | Crash Tests


But all you really need to understand is Ford wouldn't have spent the time and money developing these, if they were not needed.

Stock Front Intrusion Beam 3K Load.JPG
Aftermarket Front Intrusion Beam 3K Load.JPG
Stock Rear Intrusion Beam 3K Load.JPG
Aftermarket Rear Intrusion Beam 3K Load Corrected.JPG
Thanks for the data HM, I’ve see aftermarket crash bars that have an indent like those above, it makes sense they would not be as strong. I’ve also see some that were box type but smaller, and if the walls were thicker than the stock ones, maybe they could be as strong.

I certainly don’t think it’s wise to remove them altogether…
 

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