New Nissan Z - good potential but one big failure.

[MoatCarp]

I really like what Nissan is doing with the new Z. Its looks have really grown on me. I'd choose the Z in a heartbeat over its classic German rival, the BMW Supra. Doubly so if Nissan nails the pricing.

For the Z, I wonder if they'll also offer a lesser powertrain option like an NA v6 or turbo i4?

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[db_tanker]

As a kid I'd started going to work with my dad...first it was to DeMontrond Buick. Cool V6 and some V8 engines were awesome...at the time it didn't register but putting my hands on the tune up of a 1969 Buick GS400 wasn't a big deal...well...I was a kid...setting gap on plugs was cool Then he got tired of the dealership thing and went to an independent called the "Z Center" in Houston. This was the late 70's and I remember there were two ways to go...Weber carbs to replace the Hitachi's OR go with a V8 swap (saw one 289 and three 350 swaps, all of them were crazy according to my dad lol). My first engine to ever rebuild was an L engine from a wrecked out 260. My dad and his boss would make sure I was working by the manual, they would give me the parts I'd need as I went from bottom to top end. I heard that engine run at 10 years old. They did some of course but I did about 70% of that engine. The owner of the shop gave me 200 bucks (in 1982 money I was a rich little dude). What also happened was my love of that car, engine and whole mystique of that car. Basically it was a rip from a Jag and it was spot on. Most of them after the 1970's were, imo, garbage. This one...it looks alot like the ones I played with and hope it takes off

 

[dtech]

Tough for any maker to sell decent volumes of cars in the US market - KIA
stinger is a good example.
the Ford Bronco production is booked solid for how many yrs ?

 

[halligan1201]

I really like what Nissan is doing with the new Z. Its looks have really grown on me. I'd choose the Z in a heartbeat over its classic German rival, the BMW Supra. Doubly so if Nissan nails the pricing.

For the Z, I wonder if they'll also offer a lesser powertrain option like an NA v6 or turbo i4?

Looks have grown on me too. I think it'll be the next toy in two years once the truck is paid off. From what I've read, only the one engine but at least you get option of manual or automatic (although the way it's built, the auto is faster, even if it's less fun to drive).

 

[Dr. Zaius]

Looks have grown on me too. I think it'll be the next toy in two years once the truck is paid off. From what I've read, only the one engine but at least you get option of manual or automatic (although the way it's built, the auto is faster, even if it's less fun to drive).

This is true of most modern performance cars.

Mustang, Corvette, Camaro, all are faster with the automatic.

With modern automatics, the only advantage a manual has is the driver involvement.

 

[halligan1201]

This is true of most modern performance cars.

Mustang, Corvette, Camaro, all are faster with the automatic.

With modern automatics, the only advantage a manual has is the driver involvement.

Yep. And the Supra doesn't even bother with the manual anymore. Auto only. It's a dying option because the old days where a manual let you get around quicker are long gone.

 

[Floyd]

Yep. And the Supra doesn't even bother with the manual anymore. Auto only. It's a dying option because the old days where a manual let you get around quicker are long gone.

The real reason is that 87% of the market can't get around the block with a stick shift and another 10%, who can get around the block, still can't drive a stick.
Now, I love my 10spd, but I wouldn't care for it in my Mustang.
Besides,most drivers are stuck in urban traffic and will never experience a winding country road.

 

[Floyd]

This is true of most modern performance cars.

Mustang, Corvette, Camaro, all are faster with the automatic.

Not true on a road course.

 

[Dr. Zaius]

Not true on a road course.

I disagree.

When cost is not a consideration, the Supercars would offer a manual if it was faster.

The newest Ferrari you can buy with a manual is a 2012.

The newest Lamborghini is a 2014.

 

[Floyd]

I disagree.

When cost is not a consideration, the Supercars would offer a manual if it was faster.

The newest Ferrari you can buy with a manual is a 2012.

The newest Lamborghini is a 2014.

Fact is they don't and its not.
Notice the term "most performance cars"

I don't even know what transmissions are used in today's supercars except for the only one that matters (FordGT)
Bring your Lamborghini to BlackHawk Farms And see if you can compete with an IT car with a stick shift.

BTW.... There is no Ferrari I can buy!
Besides, with 90+% of car buyers unable to drive a stick That could be a marketing decision.(doncha think?)

 

[Dr. Zaius]

Fact is they don't and its not.
Notice the term "most performance cars"
I don't even know what transmissions are used in today's supercars except for the only one that matters (FordGT)
Bring your Lamborghini to BlackHawk Farms And see if you can compete with an IT car with a stick shift.

Comparing one car to a different car is not what is being discussed. Comparing the same car with different transmissions is.

Is an Ariel Atom with a manual faster than the Corvette with an auto around a track? Of course but that has nothing to do with the transmission.

The question is whether the Corvette is faster with a manual or auto and the answer is usually that the auto is faster.

If Ferrari/Lamborghini/Porsche were able to get faster times with a manual, they would certainly offer them as their clientele is probably one of the few remaining demographics that can actually drive a manual.

A manual transmission car in Formula One probably wouldn't even be in the top half of the field today.

Don't get me wrong, I'm one of the apparently ever more rare individuals that can drive a manual and they are indeed fun in the right vehicle. But the days of a manual being a better performing vehicle are past.

Coming all the way back around to the new Z, I think it would be a hoot with a manual. But I don't think it would be faster.

 

[Langwilliams]

I'm too old to daily drive a stick but I did for years. Just liked the feel. Here's some footage of how I'd drive to work:

 

[Floyd]

Comparing one car to a different car is not what is being discussed. Comparing the same car with different transmissions is.

Is an Ariel Atom with a manual faster than the Corvette with an auto around a track? Of course but that has nothing to do with the transmission.

The question is whether the Corvette is faster with a manual or auto and the answer is usually that the auto is faster.

If Ferrari/Lamborghini/Porsche were able to get faster times with a manual, they would certainly offer them as their clientele is probably one of the few remaining demographics that can actually drive a manual.

A manual transmission car in Formula One probably wouldn't even be in the top half of the field today.

Don't get me wrong, I'm one of the apparently ever more rare individuals that can drive a manual and they are indeed fun in the right vehicle. But the days of a manual being a better performing vehicle are past.

Coming all the way back around to the new Z, I think it would be a hoot with a manual. But I don't think it would be faster.

Alright, so you think that nearly the slowest class in SCCA with a stick has an advantage on a roadrace course against a Lambo. probably not, and I darned sure would rather own an Ariel Atom than a Lambo... Wouldn't you?
. Fortunately I still get to choose what I drive (within my needs and budget)
and so do you.
Maybe a self driving electric would be even faster without that obsolete thing called a driver, and maybe it would be more to your liking... If so, enjoy yours when it comes in.

My friend has a Harley Davidson Motorcycle which he calls a "Bike" and yes it is faster than my new Trek Sport Carbon 4, but mine is still the only "Bike" of the two and I wouldn't trade him even up.

We both know that this isn't really about track times, but more about control.
I generally prefer rear drive but I have owned a couple of front drives which were fantastic.
In the real world, a couple of seconds around a two mile track really doesn't matter as much as how to respond when you hit black ice at sixty MPH.

Thus far it has been a nice discussion involving folks who know enough to have an opinion on the subject..... but it is now going nowhere fast and I would prefer to "shift" to another subject unless of course it happens faster "automatically".

One last point...
Manual or automatic transmissions must be well matched to the vehicle and the rest of the drive train in order to be most effective along with proper tires for the application which brings up an admonition to each of us us .....
Generalities are always false!

 

[GitRDone]

Gotta weigh in on the stick vs auto "which is faster on road course" discourse: actually you're both right. The modern PDK-type dual clutch transmissions can operate in automatic mode in traffic and then bang off up and downshifts in milliseconds on the racetrack.

 

[MoatCarp]

This is true of most modern performance cars.

Mustang, Corvette, Camaro, all are faster with the automatic.

With modern automatics, the only advantage a manual has is the driver involvement.

Not only are the automatics almost always faster, but in many cases they even get better MPG numbers too. It's tough being a manual driver these days.

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