How Far Can a Gas Truck & an Electric Ford Lightning Go Towing the Same Camper

[deleriumtremor]

This guy blew up his Tesla because it would have been $22K to replace the batteries!

I thought that was a pretty well done production. By the looks of it, it cost him a whole lot more than $22K to blow it up.

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[subquark]

While EV’s are only getting started I’ve run some numbers on the lighting for my current situation, keep in mind we have a expedition to do any towing or traveling with but for me the lightning could save me a tremendous amount of money for a daily driver if I was to compare it to a comparable f150 powerboost

I drive 35k a year so at current fuel prices based on 21 mpg I’ll spend 7650 with gas at 4.59 per gallon

the lighting based off 280 miles of range will need to be charged 125 times to go 35k miles.
I currently pay 9c per kWh so to charge the truck would cost me close to 12$ to charge completely at home .. 12x125=1500 and that number could be lower with free charging at my work

Nice number crunching and you really do a nice comparison there. Thanks!

 

[dtech]

I had a buddy who was a service writer for Tesla. Tesla batteries have a service life of 5 years, at which point they need to be replace.

Well if that is true - which I'm skeptical then it's on Tesla's nickel to replace as they warrant them (as do most EV mfgs ) for 8yrs/100k miles.

"Previously, Tesla had unlimited-mileage warranties for the battery and drive unit. Now, however, there are mileage limits.

• Model S/Model X Warranty: These models are covered by an 8-year/150,000-mile warranty, whichever comes first.
• Model Y/Model 3 Short Range Warranty: The short-range variants of these models are covered for 8 years/100,000 miles.
• Model Y/Model 3 Long Range Warranty: The long-range variants are covered for 8 years/120,000 miles.

In addition, Tesla guarantees 70 percent battery retention during the covered period. If battery retention drops below this level, Tesla will replace your battery. This was something new in 2020."

 

[deleriumtremor]

HOW MUCH DOES IT COST TO REPLACE A TESLA BATTERY?
Tesla batteries are designed to last between 300,000 and 500,000 miles, so replacement shouldn't be a major concern for most drivers. It's estimated that the cost to replace a Model 3 battery will be in the $3,000 to $7,000 range.

WHAT IS THE LIFE OF A TESLA BATTERY?
Tesla batteries are designed to last between 300,000 and 500,000 miles, so replacement shouldn't be a major concern for most drivers. During that time, battery capacity will degrade in the sense that the range the battery can provide for driving will decrease slowly. Field data indicates that capacity will decrease by about 5 percent in the first 50,000 miles but will then degrade much more slowly. Ten percent battery degradation will not occur until about 200,000 miles of driving.

Link:https://evannex.com/pages/the-cost-of-a-tesla-the-costs-of-the-tesla-models-maintenance-charging-and-more#:~:text=a Tesla Battery?-,Tesla batteries are designed to last between 300,000 and 500,000,for driving will decrease slowly.

Here was the link I was thinking of. The actual cost to replace the Model 3 battery was $16,550.67.

https://www.currentautomotive.com/how-much-does-a-tesla-model-3-battery-replacement-cost/

 

[Trigganometry]

Well if that is true - which I'm skeptical then it's on Tesla's nickel to replace as they warrant them (as do most EV mfgs ) for 8yrs/100k miles.

"Previously, Tesla had unlimited-mileage warranties for the battery and drive unit. Now, however, there are mileage limits.

• Model S/Model X Warranty: These models are covered by an 8-year/150,000-mile warranty, whichever comes first.
• Model Y/Model 3 Short Range Warranty: The short-range variants of these models are covered for 8 years/100,000 miles.
• Model Y/Model 3 Long Range Warranty: The long-range variants are covered for 8 years/120,000 miles.

In addition, Tesla guarantees 70 percent battery retention during the covered period. If battery retention drops below this level, Tesla will replace your battery. This was something new in 2020."

Warranty’s are great but it’s Tesla that has to do the work. Getting them to respond will be a headache and the time it takes for them to do it and get it back to you you might expire first.

One thing about Massachusetts. We have a right to repair law here. What that means is you or your favorite shop can fix a vehicle and get used or new parts to do it. We have a guy named Richard here that buys totaled or fixable Teslas. He has many YouTube videos on what he has learned along the way. The thing that really struck me about all this was the factory’s unwillingness to sell him parts to fix himself and not a factory center. He took them to court here and won. Tesla was told either you support the parts market or you cannot sell or service cars in this State. Believe it or not they caved. Thing is not all parts are available though. So that’s where all the totals get into it. What I didn’t know was a group of parts in these things are permanently tied together. They cannot be swapped out unless you change them all.

 

[deleriumtremor]

Warranty’s are great but it’s Tesla that has to do the work. Getting them to respond will be a headache and the time it takes for them to do it and get it back to you you might expire first.

One thing about Massachusetts. We have a right to repair law here. What that means is you or your favorite shop can fix a vehicle and get used or new parts to do it. We have a guy named Richard here that buys totaled or fixable Teslas. He has many YouTube videos on what he has learned along the way. The thing that really struck me about all this was the factory’s unwillingness to sell him parts to fix himself and not a factory center. He took them to court here and won. Tesla was told either you support the parts market or you cannot sell or service cars in this State. Believe it or not they caved. Thing is not all parts are available though. So that’s where all the totals get into it. What I didn’t know was a group of parts in these things are permanently tied together. They cannot be swapped out unless you change them all.

I think I have watched a few of the YouTube clips that guy has produced. What a resourceful guy. I didn't know about the lawsuit, good for him.

 

[dtech]

What I know is that some yrs back anti hybrid or more specifically anti Prius folks were spreading FUD regards the life expectancy of a Prius battery - which for the most part proved to be just that FUD. And you can buy reconditioned Prius battery for $1k or so. Don't know if this will happen with Tesla, but I would expect eventually to see aftermarket or reconditioned replacement batteries for less cost than buying from Tesla. As far as getting Tesla to respond - have no idea if there is data to prove that out currently. They do seem to have a sound business model with high customer sat ratings and usually that extends to warranty work work.

 

[dtech]

This site renders an opinion on fracking vs lithium mining.

https://www.greenmatters.com/p/fracking-vs-lithium-mining

 

[Jbrubakerjr]

While EV’s are only getting started I’ve run some numbers on the lighting for my current situation, keep in mind we have a expedition to do any towing or traveling with but for me the lightning could save me a tremendous amount of money for a daily driver if I was to compare it to a comparable f150 powerboost

I drive 35k a year so at current fuel prices based on 21 mpg I’ll spend 7650 with gas at 4.59 per gallon

the lighting based off 280 miles of range will need to be charged 125 times to go 35k miles.
I currently pay 9c per kWh so to charge the truck would cost me close to 12$ to charge completely at home .. 12x125=1500 and that number could be lower with free charging at my work

I have Time of Use rates, so I only pay $0.045 per kWh, so half that for me...

 

[Texasota]

Thanks , Dave (@AzScorpion), for starting this thread and linking the TFL comparison test. This thread illustrates to me why a PHEV will be the perfect solution during this EV transition. This transition is going to happen, its unstoppable, but it will take a long time. During this transition a PHEV combines the advantages of both technologies. You can drive in EV mode for your short around town trips while still being able to take long road trips (and tow trailers) where the ICE technology will be more practical and convenient for a long time.

I can't wait to see the Ranger PHEV. I think it is going to be successful and popular. With the Pro Power Onboard generator you can use your Ranger to power your home during the power outages that are going to become more common and frequent in our future. If you have solar PV, like Dave, you can charge your Ranger PHEV for little/zero additional cost.

I fear that there is going to be one huge negative with the Ranger PHEV - it is going to be so popular once the secret gets out that it will be difficult to get your hands on one (think Bronco). I'll be trading my beloved Ranger for a Ranger PHEV. I'll be sure to create one of those "sold my Ranger" threads when that happens.

 

[JACKSMYDOG]

Had a C-Max for a loaner a few years back while our Flex was in for service. Seamless transition from ICE to BEV and back. Entertaining trying to keep it on battery as long as possible.


I've yet to try a veggie burger.

Me neither. I'm not against the occasional long pig under the right conditions, but we're not allowed to hunt or eat vegetarians up here. They're on the protected list.

 

[bRaptor]

The lightning battery is either 98 kWh or 131 kWh which means it will cost $0.09 * 98 = $8.82 per full charge. Which at 125 charges per year = $1,102.50. Assuming he did the extended range battery $0.09 * 131 = $11.79 per full charge or $1,473.75 per year. I was confused on the previous comment. Still pretty cheap, but I didn't calculate the air condition usage or time/work lost due to charge. Roughly you pay $0.04 per mile versus our $0.20 per mile in the ranger.

 

[got3fords]

well, ya see....this is all for the greater good.
all the extra infrastructure to build lounges to escape the heat/cold, while you charge your truck 15 times in a day on a vacation will decimate any carbon reduction gains by having electric vehicles in the first place.
these wont be just little bus shelters either.
some enterprising individual will have the Motel 6 version complete with water park, movie theater and batting cages. In the higher elevations, you might even find a hot tub overlooking the scenery.
They will be as common as 7-11's if they play their cards right

ok, that's pretty funny right there

 

[JACKSMYDOG]

The lightning battery is either 98 kWh or 131 kWh which means it will cost $0.09 * 98 = $8.82 per full charge. Which at 125 charges per year = $1,102.50. Assuming he did the extended range battery $0.09 * 131 = $11.79 per full charge or $1,473.75 per year. I was confused on the previous comment. Still pretty cheap, but I didn't calculate the air condition usage or time/work lost due to charge. Roughly you pay $0.04 per mile versus our $0.20 per mile in the ranger.

At the 21 minute mark he said he paid $27 for the 66% charge (~$40 for a full charge).

 

[ControlNode]

I was really thinking about a Cyber Truck, but as more data was coming out it became clear that to get any useable towing range would require the much more expensive model and even then, range was going to be mah. This is the reason I when to the Ranger. Main point of electric I liked is that I could leave it parked for months with no ill impact on the motor, ICE cars/trucks need to be run regularly (battery maintainer is not enough for engine/trans health, but does allow it to sit some and start with confidence).

Tony I saw that there was a company who was designing a solar panel tonneau cover. I'm not sure if it's out yet but it would work for some. Only issue is it would be heavy and kind of unrealistic for use for many. How do you travel with all your stuff in the bed then gain access to the full bed? I think the one I saw was hinged so it pushed up against the bulkhead which gives you 75% access. But with all the stuff we just had loaded up I'd need to have full access.

Looks like a full fold in this image, but the pictures I never saw it up blocking the rear glass, But my current tonneau cover blocks that window when fully open as well. Website still states that production is expected to start Q2 of 2022, well that is now in the past and no update.

https://goterravis.com/trucks/

Most travel trailers are coming with solar packages standard now. It would be nice to be able to hook that into the truck and charge as you go. The Lightning is already equipped with an inverter so I"m sure it's easily adaptable.

I know that there was an image where Telsa showed a trailer behind the Cyber Truck and I said then, and still say now, if that trailer had regen braking, a skate of batteries in the floor and a power connector to share that compacity with the towing truck that would be great for EV towing. IMO, Solar on an EV is more about super slow charging, almost just a battery maintainer really. I doubt with current solar and the amount you could put on a truck and trailer that with that combined power input you would see 5 miles of range added during a drive on a sunny day. At best solar can allow the AC to run on a hot day while parked with minimal charge loss.

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