Intake Valve Cleaning

[peterson1604]

So I posted about using CRC Intake Valve cleaner last week hoping to get some feedback but just ended up with a couple of guys arguing pretty much the entire thread which resulted in it being closed down by the mediator.

However, what I think I learned from some who did offer information was that with 78,000 miles on the 2019 engine it may be best to avoid this due to pieces breaking off and possibly pitting and damaging the turbo. Thoughts on this? The truck runs fine, I use top tier fuel and higher octane when prices are affordable but I love this truck and hope to keep it running strong for several more years. I'm not an engine mechanice so I'm looking for advice from the experts who are more knowledgable than I am regarding this issue or concern.

I don't want to hear whether you think the engine needs it or not unless you have solid information. Just because Ford doesn't have it listed for service doesn't mean it's not worth doing. For excample, Ford states tranny service every 150,000 miles. Every Ford mechanic I talk to recommends at 60 to 75,000 miles base on their experiece working on the truck. So please, no arguing this time, just information as I'm sure there are others interested in this topic.

Thanks!
Scott

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[Titchadesh]

I’m interested as well as I’ve not been able to make a solid decision either way. Following—

 

[Stevedbvik1]

I will concur on the “ pieces of carbon damaging turbine wheel of turbo” . It’s a thing, saw it many times in my last 10 years of employment at a turbo sales and service facility. I can’t speak to specific incidents involving CRC cleaners but the logic makes sense. Our shop never did that type of cleaning.

 

[RangerBill]

I've heard that if you have the issue of carbon build up on the valves, that the engine will idle poorly with missing at idle. So you will have a way to determine if you need the service. Walnut blasting is the recommended way to clean them.

 

[Burnt Money]

I have floated the idea of having the walnut blasting being performed. At 113,000k miles so far I have decided to just run it till there is a problem. So far it has been running flawless since I bought it. I don’t want to risk causing an issue when there isn’t one currently.

 

[RangerBill]

Here are links to videos from Ford Tech Makuloco concerning valve cleaning and symptons:

 

[airline tech]

For me - The Debate is dependent on - How much carbon deposits are present on the back side of the Intake Valves
If light to moderate - then the cleaner should dissolve the carbon small enough to expel it safely past the (Hot Side) of the turbo
If Heavy deposits - the carbon (COULD) be large enough to pass through the Exhaust Valve and hit the (Hot Side) of the turbo blades - potentially damaging them.

So in order to actually see - how much of a carbon deposit buildup there actually is:
A Borescope of the valves is required.

And the induction point of the - Chemical is also important and this would be - just before the T-Body with the straw but the clamp still secure enough to get 2,000 RPMs and short bursts of chemical.
Important - is to induce - SHORT BURSTS - so the engine can ingest the chemical without damaging the associated engine components

Exhaust Valves
Cylinder Walls
Spark Plugs
O2 Sensors
Cat

Its a VALID debate but really depends on the severity of carbon buildup, and the most effective way to do it safely is the - Walnut Blasting method as long as you use the detailed specific procedures - Valve (Fully Closed) and clean the debris - so it does not enter the cylinder.

So a good borescope of the valves (inspection) and then make the determination of severity of buildup and decide which cleaning method is the best approach.

 

[DLinc184]

So, if I'm understanding correctly, there are some on this forum that believe that somehow, a piece of carbon that may flake off an intake valve, will ,again somehow, either go upstream and damage the compressor turbo blade, or it will flake off, go thru an explosion in the cylinder, and cause damage to exhaust side turbo blade. Really?

 

[Chris M]

So, if I'm understanding correctly, there are some on this forum that believe that somehow, a piece of carbon that may flake off an intake valve, will ,again somehow, either go upstream and damage the compressor turbo blade, or it will flake off, go thru an explosion in the cylinder, and cause damage to exhaust side turbo blade. Really?

Ah....if only I had stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night I could answer that question for you.

As it is though, there ARE actual mechanics and engineers qualified to answer, and appear to be trying to do so.

 

[got3fords]

Here are links to videos from Ford Tech Makuloco concerning valve cleaning and symptons:

Cool! I was not clear on how the walnut blasting worked.

 

[21rangerCactus]

I have a 2021 and have been tuned since new. . At 50 or 60k I used amsoil power foam from behind the TB. I didn't notice any difference. I'm at 134k and have not done anything since. My gas mileage is avg the same as the first year I got it, Power is still great and no engine miss or erratic idle.

I change my oil every 10k using synthetic oil and I use top tier fuel. Majority of its life on 87. When I think about it I'll throw in a bottle of Techron.

When it cools off I plan on taking the intake off myself to take a look. I'm thinking I could clean it good enough with a small steel brush or maybe even a dremel with a steel brush bit of some sort.

So..I wouldn't worry about it unless you are having some sort of issue or your curiosity likes for your life to be much harder then it is. Lol

 

[got3fords]

So..I wouldn't worry about it unless you are having some sort of issue or your curiosity likes for your life to be much harder then it is. Lol

I think FordTechMakuloco eluded to that, that you will start noticing missing or bad gas mileage or some indicator that there is build up.

 

[harringtondav]

No knowledge based opinion from me.
What I have learned is every decision is a compromise, and every decision has risks.

Based on more knowledgeable comments here, get the walnut treatment. Now or when engine performance degrades.
It seems the advantage of pulling the intake now is you will have visual of what 78K miles of carbon looks like, and if the blasting is necessary. After things are cleaned up you can move forward with periodic chemical cleanings and be fairly certain you have another 78K miles.

 

[airline tech]

So, if I'm understanding correctly, there are some on this forum that believe that somehow, a piece of carbon that may flake off an intake valve, will ,again somehow, either go upstream and damage the compressor turbo blade, or it will flake off, go thru an explosion in the cylinder, and cause damage to exhaust side turbo blade. Really?

Not upstream but yes - Downstream exhaust flow - if induced correctly
Its just the speed of the turbo that brings in the -potential of damage
A large piece of debris has the potential to - Knick the blades or deform them
a (Approximated) speed of the turbo @ 2,000 RPM (Engine Speed) and No Load would be about 25,000 RPMs.
This (FOD) damage can cause the turbo to be off balance which will lead to bearing failure.

Again - its not a chemical clean procedure (WILL) cause damage it's a (Possible) - since we cannot control how we dissolve the carbon deposits and how small or large of a chunk can be broken off. - So we can safely say - its a potential RISK

The removed carbon has to exit somewhere, and it follows the exhaust path, the most critical point on that path (as far as FOD) is the turbine blades.

So size of the carbon chunk (FOD) and the impact velocity on the turbine are the deciding factors on (potential damage) as well as impact point on the blade.

This is why - Walnut Blasting is the recommended procedure, you have better control on removing all the carbon deposits and keep them out of the exhaust path as long as you are following strict procedures

 

[peterson1604]

For me - The Debate is dependent on - How much carbon deposits are present on the back side of the Intake Valves
If light to moderate - then the cleaner should dissolve the carbon small enough to expel it safely past the (Hot Side) of the turbo
If Heavy deposits - the carbon (COULD) be large enough to pass through the Exhaust Valve and hit the (Hot Side) of the turbo blades - potentially damaging them.

So in order to actually see - how much of a carbon deposit buildup there actually is:
A Borescope of the valves is required.

And the induction point of the - Chemical is also important and this would be - just before the T-Body with the straw but the clamp still secure enough to get 2,000 RPMs and short bursts of chemical.
Important - is to induce - SHORT BURSTS - so the engine can ingest the chemical without damaging the associated engine components

Exhaust Valves
Cylinder Walls
Spark Plugs
O2 Sensors
Cat

Its a VALID debate but really depends on the severity of carbon buildup, and the most effective way to do it safely is the - Walnut Blasting method as long as you use the detailed specific procedures - Valve (Fully Closed) and clean the debris - so it does not enter the cylinder.

So a good borescope of the valves (inspection) and then make the determination of severity of buildup and decide which cleaning method is the best approach.

Great information, thank you!

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