10,000 Oil change interval.

[JeffWoodall]

sorry, you're just wrong. a direct inject engine like the one in the ranger produces soot that will make the oil black very quickly. the oil is designed to handle that, as it is a normal condition. looking at the oil and deciding to change it because of its color is something people did 50 years ago, with different oil in different engines, and is simply not relevant today.

I don't change the oil because it is black, that was just one point. It's still dirty oil, and gets dirtier. As I said, I change my oil every 5K miles. I don't claim to be an expert on this, my only qualifications are that I was a tank/wheel mechanic in the Army at the age of 17, so, to each his own. Not trying to be right or wrong, just stating my opinion. I know about DI engines producing soot to make the oil black...it gets blacker and thicker as time goes on as well (dirtier).

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[AdamHarris]

It has been proven that too frequent oil changes can also have an adverse effect. Microscopic bits of copper (from cam bearings etc.) and such travel through the oil and aid the oil in lubrication of the engine. Changing the oil removes these microscopic particles.

No RangerPride this was Not directed at your last post lol.

 

[JeffWoodall]

It has been proven that too frequent oil changes can also have an adverse effect. Microscopic bits of copper (from cam bearings etc.) and such travel through the oil and aid the oil in lubrication of the engine. Changing the oil removes these microscopic particles.

No RangerPride this was Not directed at your last post lol.

I agree, that's why 5K miles is a compromise. I always knew (felt) even back in the day, 3K mile oil changes were over board and more for the retailer than the consumer.

 

[LoneRNGR]

It has been proven that too frequent oil changes can also have an adverse effect. Microscopic bits of copper (from cam bearings etc.) and such travel through the oil and aid the oil in lubrication of the engine. Changing the oil removes these microscopic particles.

No RangerPride this was Not directed at your last post lol.

I call BULLSHIT.

 

[Leftcoast]

To me, this is a common sense pragmatic issue. The engineers say you "can" go 10K miles before your oil needs to be changed. Any oil, in any engine will get dirty as times goes on, no matter how hard or easy you are on the engine; how many oil changes has anyone ever done with several thousand miles, where the oil wasn't black? Black=dirty oil, period. The engine will last longer with cleaner oil, period. I change mine every 5K miles and will continue doing so. As a side note, surely the Auto Executives would want our engines to last as long as they could so we wouldn't buy a new vehicle, right? They have our best interest in mind, right? 10K miles my arse..

Ignorance is bliss.

 

[JeffWoodall]

Ignorance is bliss.

Oh, one of them people...you'd know I'm sure little buddy. Take it somewhere else. You are one of those "I like to make jackass negative comments to people that disagree with me". I know the type, poor little guy.

 

[AdamHarris]

I call BULLSHIT.

You can call whatever you like, just learn you something today.

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s12206-015-0141-y

 

[ottocycle]

You can call whatever you like, just learn you something today.

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s12206-015-0141-y

This paper concerns copper oxide nano particles as part of the lubricant additive package, not wear metals in the oil.

 

[ottocycle]

I decided to test what I already knew to be true, that modern engines with modern oils can go much longer between oil changes than engines of the past.

Many on this site and on most other forums still claim the Ford recommended 10K oil change interval is foolish. Being a hardcore gearhead and a former Ford mechanic, I know that oil technology and engine technology has made great strides in the last few decades, and I feel the 3-5K mile oil changes are a waste of money and an environmental irresponsibility in my view.

The tolerances of todays engines and the great efforts made in friction reduction, emission and fuel controls have payed great dividends in oil life. I've noticed that the oil in my modern Ford's is cleaner at 10,000 miles than the oil was in my 70's and 80's Fords at 1000 miles.

As the oil analysis report shows, everything is A-okay after a 9800 mile oil change interval. The report says that potassium is higher than would be expected, which could indicate coolant consumption (or nothing at all). I'll go with "nothing at all" at this point, given I haven't added an ounce of coolant in to 40,000 miles I've driven the truck and it still indicated full.

Let the flaming commence.

Agreed with the assessment. Potassium is almost definitely an indicator of coolant in the oil. There isn't much, though. Watch in subsequent analysis, if you choose to continue. If it doesn't get very close to zro, there is likely a minor internal leak. The oil viscosity is a little low and out of grade. This could be due to the noted fuel dilution or minor shear of the oil, or both. The flash point they list is low compared to their assumtion of what it should be. An actual baseline sample of unused oil would provide a definite value with which to compare.

To get real benefit from used oil analysis, you should also provide the lab with an unused sample of the oil being used in the vehicle. This provides an accurate baseline with which to compare values from the used oil analysis. Blackstone services the consumer market, and to keep costs down (I assume), they do not ask for a baseline sample. Instead, they provide "universal averages" which are basically useless because they often do not account for different oil chemistry, the vehicle, or the vehicle usage. Comparing the actual used oil results to the "averages" does not show the change in condition of the oil in use in your vehicle.

I'm in the lubricant industry. If anyone has questions about oil analysis or lubricants/lubrication, I may be able to provide answers.

 

[Zaph]

Looks great. With that report I would be fine with a 10k oil change also.

Blackstone recommended a 5k interval for me due to fuel dilution.

 

[Leftcoast]

Oh, one of them people...you'd know I'm sure little buddy. Take it somewhere else. You are one of those "I like to make jackass negative comments to people that disagree with me". I know the type, poor little guy.

I’m just appreciating your extensive engineering background. You’re equating bad oil to dark oil. Please expand on this. I can’t wait.

 

[AdamHarris]

This paper concerns copper oxide nano particles as part of the lubricant additive package, not wear metals in the oil.

OK well I’m all about learning something myself. So I’m completely off base with what I said that Microscopic wear metals don’t aid in lubrication at all?

 

[ottocycle]

OK well I’m all about learning something myself. So I’m completely off base with what I said that Microscopic wear metals don’t aid in lubrication at all?

Correct. Wear metals are either soft enough or small enough to not cause any harm, or get caught in the filter, or become abrasive particles in the oil. One thing that may cause confusion is the information provided in an oil analysis report. The list of additive elements shown are metallics that are part of larger compounds that often have an organic component, as well. For example, there is no elemental zinc in engine oil; the oil contains some version of zinc dialkyl dithiophosphate (ZDDP) which is a compound composed of zinc, phosphorus, sulfur, and some other elements. Also, these additive compounds don't necessarily have the same properties as the elemental version of the substance. As an analogy, consider sodium and chlorine. Sodium is explosive when exposed to water, and chlorine is highly toxic. However, sodium chloride (table salt) is beneficial and necessary to animal life.

I'm starting to spiral on what was a simple question. I hope the above is helpful and understandable.

 

[Leftcoast]

Correct. Wear metals are either soft enough or small enough to not cause any harm, or get caught in the filter, or become abrasive particles in the oil. One thing that may cause confusion is the information provided in an oil analysis report. The list of additive elements shown are metallics that are part of larger compounds that often have an organic component, as well. For example, there is no elemental zinc in engine oil; the oil contains some version of zinc dialkyl dithiophosphate (ZDDP) which is a compound composed of zinc, phosphorus, sulfur, and some other elements. Also, these additive compounds don't necessarily have the same properties as the elemental version of the substance. As an analogy, consider sodium and chlorine. Sodium is explosive when exposed to water, and chlorine is highly toxic. However, sodium chloride (table salt) is beneficial and necessary to animal life.

I'm starting to spiral on what was a simple question. I hope the above is helpful and understandable.

Ramble on. This thread could use something besides shade tree opinions.

 

[AdamHarris]

Correct. Wear metals are either soft enough or small enough to not cause any harm, or get caught in the filter, or become abrasive particles in the oil. One thing that may cause confusion is the information provided in an oil analysis report. The list of additive elements shown are metallics that are part of larger compounds that often have an organic component, as well. For example, there is no elemental zinc in engine oil; the oil contains some version of zinc dialkyl dithiophosphate (ZDDP) which is a compound composed of zinc, phosphorus, sulfur, and some other elements. Also, these additive compounds don't necessarily have the same properties as the elemental version of the substance. As an analogy, consider sodium and chlorine. Sodium is explosive when exposed to water, and chlorine is highly toxic. However, sodium chloride (table salt) is beneficial and necessary to animal life.

I'm starting to spiral on what was a simple question. I hope the above is helpful and understandable.

Not even...just a little bit?...ha!

Thats something I have heard for many many years (that wear metals aid in lubrication) but I don’t know enough about it and can’t find any real information to support my argument so when you’re wrong you’re wrong I guess.

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