Overall FORD Quality

[P. A. Schilke]

ok - do you make that assertation from personal experience or ? just wondering where Ford stands in comparison to other makers. As I've stated in the past I'd prefer a manual control system, have only had one auto HVAC system in a car (1991 Taurus SHO) that worked satisfactorily and back then it was a simpler single zone system, highly likely the dual zone increase the issues. The current one in my Ranger is ok but being temp sensitive I often have to adjust the temp level plus when driving in 100 F temps had to use the manual fan control to keep the cabin cool. I'll be really p*ssed if the thing sh*ts the bed at some point.

Hi Dtech,

I was at the forefront of this EATC development when working with Livernois vehicle. Dave H was the engineer and he was developing the system for EATC. Both the Livernois Garage services and I agreed this was a total abuse of electronics. But Dave H indicated the objective was to make it such the customer did not have to think to adjust the HVAC system...

Sheesh....

best,
Phil

Sponsored

 

[BettaRanga]

My MY21 build from late 2021 came with a busted rear brake caliper and is missing a rear door sill plate. Brake caliper was fixed by dealer first week because it was leaking brake fluid and I had a Bronco Sport loaner. I let the door sill go but maybe I should have made them buy me a new rear set.

 

[dtech]

Hi Dtech,

I was at the forefront of this EATC development when working with Livernois vehicle. Dave H was the engineer and he was developing the system for EATC. Both the Livernois Garage services and I agreed this was a total abuse of electronics. But Dave H indicated the objective was to make it such the customer did not have to think to adjust the HVAC system...

Sheesh....

best,
Phil

Well I would say he failed as I've always had to adjust primarily the temp settings but occasionally other ones as well , I don't see anything wrong with having to turn a few knobs, safer than trying to adjust the tiny temp buttons we have in the Ranger.

 

[dtech]

Well fixing the BMS would be a good place to start, gotta be costing Ford a bundle to replace all those batteries which shouldn't be expiring so quickly. Or could it be possible that the Ford BMS engineer is getting kickbacks from Ford's battery supplier ? Mr Farley, change that charging algorthym .

 

[gtyates]

As far as my Ranger it's been flawless beside the HVAC issue, I think most things pre Covid were. I don't see the Rangers as having as many quality issues as the other lines. Just look at the Bronco which has numerous issue after issue. Heck the new MIC top (second design) is also having cracks and delaminating. Yes Ford contracts these out but you'd "think" after the mess they had with the first hardtops they could at least get the seconds ones done right.

My '19 is in the shop now for the HVAC box... Ugh. Otherwise, the truck has been very solid, so with almost 60k on it I can't overly complain. I did have to have the PCM reflash done to smooth out the transmission shifting, as the previous owner never did, and my dealer comped it. Fortunatley I did purchase an extended warranty, so this will only cost me my deductible. I bought this truck in March, 2022 with around 40k on it.

 

[shred5]

Friggen paint on the Ranger is the main thing I have to complain about. Just have to look at it and it chips. Just got the whole hood repainted because of chips. I had to take it in because someone hit me and very minor damage and had the hood redone since I was there. Never seen so many bug deflectors on the front of a model truck before now I know why. I just do not like the look of them but I might add one.

 

[yamahaSHO]

ok - do you make that assertation from personal experience or ? just wondering where Ford stands in comparison to other makers. As I've stated in the past I'd prefer a manual control system, have only had one auto HVAC system in a car (1991 Taurus SHO) that worked satisfactorily and back then it was a simpler single zone system, highly likely the dual zone increase the issues. The current one in my Ranger is ok but being temp sensitive I often have to adjust the temp level plus when driving in 100 F temps had to use the manual fan control to keep the cabin cool. I'll be really p*ssed if the thing sh*ts the bed at some point.

I never understood the dual zone systems... Twice the failure potential with an average air temperature. I always use them as one. The buttons on the Ranger climate control are annoying... Most of the time, I cannot see them as it's a dark area with faint graphics/lettering.

The old SHO EATC was pretty good... But I never used it in auto mode. Generally, it's full hot or full cold, just adjust the fan speed.

 

[dtech]

I never understood the dual zone systems... Twice the failure potential with an average air temperature. I always use them as one. The buttons on the Ranger climate control are annoying... Most of the time, I can see them as it's a dark area with faint graphics/lettering.

The old SHO EATC was pretty good... But I never used it in auto mode. Generally, it's full hot or full cold, just adjust the fan speed.

yeah on the SHO I remember that it work well as now that I recall it did on my 1986 single zone Saab. But on my later 9-5s both had issues with the dual zone Valeo made box, wasn't warping like the Ford but most issues were in the air distribution and air blend mechanisms - stop arms would crack as would blend door shafts - but fixing these could be done by contorting your body up and under the dash. I'm anti x warranty and too cheap to buy one so rolling the dice on the unit but it sounding almost as if it's not a matter of if but when it will fail.

 

[Dr_Strangelove]

I had spoken with a wise old guy once that had a past life in auto parts supply and he had educated me that there are rejection thresholds set at different levels for re-tooling and quality adjustments. The manufacturer can slide these thresholds based on their parts demand and cost basis. So for example, as a machine is cranking out a stamping of a bracket for part of the HVAC system - the manufacturer can determine a "reject" rate of 1/500 parts, 1/1000 parts, 1/10000 parts, etc. If the # of rejects per batch exceeds the threshold then the machine has to be shut down and inspected and potentially retooled. That is very expensive - therefore lower thresholds will be set normally and a red line will be determined for the future.

My point with this anecdote being - if Ford is serious about quality then they need to also be serious about eating the costs internally and trimming some fat within Executive bonus packages. They can't pass quality costs on to the consumer, else they will need to create a brand underneath Ford and Lincoln.

 

[BettaRanga]

I never understood the dual zone systems... Twice the failure potential with an average air temperature. I always use them as one. The buttons on the Ranger climate control are annoying... Most of the time, I can see them as it's a dark area with faint graphics/lettering.

The old SHO EATC was pretty good... But I never used it in auto mode. Generally, it's full hot or full cold, just adjust the fan speed.

The other day I got in and was very confused when the dual zone was set to be used separately. One side was on low and one was 85 degrees. Ghost in the Ranger did that because it wasn’t me.

 

[JohnnyO]

Maybe our favorite retired Ford engineer can chime in.

https://www.roadandtrack.com/news/a...ity-nothing-else-matters/?src=socialflowFBCAD


Ford CEO Jim Farley told a group of retired engineers that it would take several years for the Blue Oval to fix its quality problems.

BY MACK HOGAN
DEC 19, 2022

JEFF KOWALSKY/GETTY IMAGES
Ford has a quality problem. The company has struggled to launch new products over the last few years, leading to a slew of recall and warranty claims that are costing the Blue Oval a ton of money. CEO Jim Farley says getting quality up is his number one priority and, speaking to a group of retired engineers, he didn't make it sound easy.
“Fixing quality is my No. 1 priority,” Farley said, according to Ford Authority. “It is the most important initiative in the whole company. And it’s going to take several years. We didn’t lose it in just one or two years. Until we fix quality, nothing else matters.”
RELATED STORIES

New Bronco Owners Report Hardtop Quality Issues

Ford Bronco Driveshafts to Get Replaced at Dealers

Ford to Replace Every Bronco's Molded-In Color Top
Ford Authority reports that Farley was speaking to the Ford Retired Engineering Executives group, referencing a quality dip that has caused Ford products like the Explorer and F-150 PowerBoost hybrid to receive poor marks in Consumer Reports' reliability survey. The result has hurt Ford's bottom line, as Autoblog points out that over the past few years the company has spent significantly more on warranty claims and recalled far more vehicles than crosstown rival General Motors.
There's reason to be hopeful, however. After two years in last place, last year Lincoln climbed to midpack in the Consumer Reports reliability survey, as Autoblog notes. Still, it's going to be a bit before Ford's quality woes are over. The brand has to hope it doesn't alienate too many customers in the meantime.

 

[Langwilliams]

The first step in fixing a problem is admitting you have a problem.

Maybe our resident engineer can also chime in on how it seems every time there's a cutback in white color staffing they push out the senior highly paid, highly experienced engineers and replace them with you inexperienced ones that are cheaper. I'm guessing this is at least part of the problem.

 

[AzScorpion]

Jon, there's already a thread going on this here.

https://www.ranger5g.com/forum/threads/overall-ford-quality.22853/

 

[stringbreaker]

Not only in the auto business I worked at the only commercial airplane company in the USA and I've seen it happen there. Sending what was supposed to be the core compentencey of the business the wing to Japan and vending out things that were supposed to stay in house. Thank you Harry Stonecipher and others for sending a once premier company down the crapper

 

[JasonTremor]

I'll agree Ford has a quality issue currently in a few areas. Body fit and finish and some of their engine issues make me question if they are executing on continuous improvement or not. If you have looked at the body lines and panel gaps on a new 2015 to 2022 F150, you may have noticed what I noticed. They have also continued to have timing chain/cam phaser issues in the 3.5 Ecoboost since it first debuted in 2011. They have had 12 years to perfect those cam phasers and have not successfully fixed those yet. Actually, their cam phaser issues go all the way back to the 4.6/5.4 3v engines in the 2005 ish timeframe, so if I were being real, they have had about 17 years to perfect those.

To be fair, other manufacturers seem to have just as many long running issues as well and it is not just a Ford problem.

Sponsored