How long has Ford been using an electric secondary water pump for cabin heat?

[Stevedbvik1]

Thanks, the Start/Stop never occurred to me as the reason for these things.

What are the odds they're smart enough to run an electric oil pump to the turbocharger for the same reason?

You know that just triggered a thought about ASS and engine oil pressure. Let’s just say you’re zipping along on the Xway and exit up to a stop light. Your turbo is going to be still spinning along and ASS shuts off your engine and oil pressure. Not good for long term turbo bearing life. Really wondering if there is some sort of provision to keep oil moving through the turbo.

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[ctechbob]

You know that just triggered a thought about ASS and engine oil pressure. Let’s just say you’re zipping along on the Xway and exit up to a stop light. Your turbo is going to be still spinning along and ASS shuts off your engine and oil pressure. Not good for long term turbo bearing life. Really wondering if there is some sort of provision to keep oil moving through the turbo.

No different from being parked in your driveway and shutting it off with the key. In both cases, the engine is going to be at idle. The turbo will still be spinning, but not fast. Plus it is a ball-bearing unit and as long as there is oil in the bearing it should be fine.

That doesn't mean I think it will be good for it, which is one of the reasons my ASS is disabled, but I don't think it is super terrible for it either.

 

[Stevedbvik1]

No different from being parked in your driveway and shutting it off with the key. In both cases, the engine is going to be at idle. The turbo will still be spinning, but not fast. Plus it is a ball-bearing unit and as long as there is oil in the bearing it should be fine.

That doesn't mean I think it will be good for it, which is one of the reasons my ASS is disabled, but I don't think it is super terrible for it either.

It’s not a ball bearing turbo. Conventional bronze turbo bearings in it. If you’re hooting along on the xway and in the boost you could see 100,000 rpm turbo speeds. I don’t think it spools down to “low” speeds that fast. It’s a unique scenario but it happens and over long term its not a good thing. The turbo is water cooled so that would help with the oil coking up but zero oil pressure and 10’s of thousands of turbo rpm’s are not a good mix. Ford engineered the ASS to meet EPA requirements and not necessarily to extend component life. Again I’m talking long term. I also turn off ASS as part of my preflight procedure.

 

[Miles Mac]

so then is the pump also deleted for the lucky few with the ASS delete from the chip shortage? IIRC it was a $50 refund. how much does the pump cost?

My '23 has the ASS Delete and I still have the water pump under the coolant reservoir/surge tank.
If memory servs, the H2O pump also functions to cool the turbo when temps are high after engine shut down.

 

[JustinR]

Where would I be looking for that electric coolant pump? By the overflow bottle? I have a 2022 with the auto stop-start delete, but my wife's new Nautilus (2023 model, 2.0L EcoBoost - very similar to the 2.3 if I am not mistaken) does have auto stop-start. I'd want to poke around that car too.
I often do wonder about the turbo in that Nautilus when the engine shuts down in traffic.

 

[Miles Mac]

Where would I be looking for that electric coolant pump? By the overflow bottle? I have a 2022 with the auto stop-start delete, but my wife's new Nautilus (2023 model, 2.0L EcoBoost - very similar to the 2.3 if I am not mistaken) does have auto stop-start. I'd want to poke around that car too.
I often do wonder about the turbo in that Nautilus when the engine shuts down in traffic.

It's behind and slightly below the coolant reservoir/surge tank on the passenger side, hoses connect to the fire wall / heater. Found a pic on ebay of the pump

 

[Rp930]

I wondered why the AC seemed to blow cool air for several seconds when the ASS shut the engine off, is that what we're talking about?

No, this pump has nothing to do with a/c. It stays cool until the evaporator warms up. If it warms up enough the engine will restart.

 

[Motorpsychology]

yeah those types of pumps for the cabin heat are becoming commonplace on newer models, I can't speak to the tranny but what ctechbob says makes sense. Hopefully the tranny pump is reasonably easy to access or bulletproof if there is such a thing. So another thread counted the no of heat exchangers on the Ranger - think it was 5 or more, wonder how many electric pumps are involved - abs, tranny, cabin, in tank fuel, maybe vacuum brake , come to mind.

I don't think there is a backup for the power brake vacuum. I rolled mine down the driveway with the ign on engine off, in Neutral. The brakes had enough vacuum for one press, after that, the pedal was rock hard and negligible stopping power.

 

[JimJa]

Very interesting discussion. My 2 cents:
- Turbo is small to reduce turbo lag. It spins about 50K at idle and just under 200K at WOT. It takes a time to spin down and is why Ford recommends letting the vehicle idle for a minute or so before shutting down.
- Heater core receives hot water from the engine every time the engine is running, hot or cold. this is because it's easier to maintain a constant temperature form the HVAC system, The result is a more comfortable passenger experience. It's also why the A/C unit cycles. Between the two, hot or cold, the cabin temperature is more constant. Today's vehicles are rolling computers.

Can any one verify that the aux water pump provides cooling water to the turbo when the engine is shut down? This is of major positive importance if so. It would be great if oil was supplied for brief period after shut down as well. But, and as Steve noted, this is exactly why full synthetic is important. The turbo bearings get significant heat sink at shut down and any coking that occurs on those bearing will inhibit oil flow. Synthetic oil will reduce that and lead to a longer turbo life.

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