Coming to a complete stop, Auto Stop kicks off engine and truck leaps forward

[Rich_W]

My 2019 Lariat 2WD with approx 5000 miles has developed a really dangerous issue. This has happened now about a half dozen times.

When decelerating quickly and coming to a complete stop, the engine cuts off and the truck leaps forward a couple of feet overpowering the brakes.

Once it happened pulling into a parking space and my girl went up the curb. Fortunately no damage. Then yesterday it happed to me coming off a highway exit and just before the stop sign a driver switched lanes and I needed to brake hard. As soon as the truck came to a full stop the engine kicked off and the truck leaped forward and we almost rear ended the car in front.

This is an absolute safety hazard and I'm really aggravated with this truck. She's afraid to drive it. Quite honestly I have a laundry list of issues with the truck. Time to write a lemon law letter. Ford is getting this in writing before it goes to the dealership.

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[Zaph]

Not really understanding how the truck leaps forward when the engine shuts off. Is this not related to the autostop feature and rather some sort of transmission issue? Do you mean the engine cuts off while decelerating then fires up while you are stopped and lurches forward?

Yeah sounds pretty bad. Better get a multi-camera video showing it, and you'll probably have to have one pointed at your feet to prove you're not an idiot and doing something stupid with the brake and the gas... because that's what they will immediately assume.

 

[Rp930]

The truck leaps forward with the brakes applied?

 

[P. A. Schilke]

My 2019 Lariat 2WD with approx 5000 miles has developed a really dangerous issue. This has happened now about a half dozen times.

When decelerating quickly and coming to a complete stop, the engine cuts off and the truck leaps forward a couple of feet overpowering the brakes.

Once it happened pulling into a parking space and my girl went up the curb. Fortunately no damage. Then yesterday it happed to me coming off a highway exit and just before the stop sign a driver switched lanes and I needed to brake hard. As soon as the truck came to a full stop the engine kicked off and the truck leaped forward and we almost rear ended the car in front.

This is an absolute safety hazard and I'm really aggravated with this truck. She's afraid to drive it. Quite honestly I have a laundry list of issues with the truck. Time top write a lemon law letter. Ford is getting this in writing before it goes to the dealership. Going to try and shoot a video of what's happening.

Hi Rich,

Something is not right....could it be the torque converter is not unlocking? Very weird and needs diagnostic work for sure....Good luck!

Best,
Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retired

 

[Ranger Boyd]

Hi Rich,

Something is not right....could it be the torque converter is not unlocking? Very weird and needs diagnostic work for sure....Good luck!

Best,
Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retired

 

[Ranger Boyd]

I’m embarrassed to admit this, but the same thing happened to me and I went back to the dealership and they couldn’t find anything wrong. As I was leaving it happened again. In a test drive with the mechanic, it happened again. This dumba## was applying the brake and the accelerator at the same time. Eco boost won every time! 40 years of driving and that had never happened. I pivot on my heel rather than lift my foot. Pedals are to close to do that. Hasn’t happened since! Hope you guys enjoy my shame but I hope that’s the same problem! Good luck!

 

[shred5]

I’m embarrassed to admit this, but the same thing happened to me and I went back to the dealership and they couldn’t find anything wrong. As I was leaving it happened again. In a test drive with the mechanic, it happened again. This dumba## was applying the brake and the accelerator at the same time. Eco boost won every time! 40 years of driving and that had never happened. I pivot on my heel rather than lift my foot. Pedals are to close to do that. Hasn’t happened since! Hope you guys enjoy my shame but I hope that’s the same problem! Good luck!

This happened too me twice in a hard braking situation when I first got mine.
It is because of the soft break pedal..

I had just driven a escape and you barley touched the break pedal and it stops. Very touchy.
I had a situation where someone cut off the guy in front and he locked it up.
I hit the break on my Ranger and because the brake is so soft and goes so far down my foot would clip the gas.
The long travel distance of the break pedal is a issue. Took so long to get the truck to stop I hit harder on the break and clipped the gas pedal

My Colorado the break never gets down to where the gas is so no issue. The break pedal on the ranger goes so far down you can clip the gas pedal. I have big feet so it makes it even more of a issue.

Way to spongy and you get used to it as long as you don't drive another vehicle.

That is what is happening OP you are hitting the gas at the same time.
Freaked me out.. Took a bit to figure it out after the second time.

 

[Ranger Boyd]

This happened too me twice in a hard braking situation when I first got mine.
It is because of the soft break pedal..

I had just driven a escape and you barley touched the break pedal and it stops. Very touchy.
I had a situation where someone cut off the guy in front and he locked it up.
I hit the break on my Ranger and because the brake is so soft and goes so far down my foot would clip the gas.
The long travel distance of the break pedal is a issue. Took so long to get the truck to stop I hit harder on the break and clipped the gas pedal

My Colorado the break never gets down to where the gas is so no issue. The break pedal on the ranger goes so far down you can clip the gas pedal. I have big feet so it makes it even more of a issue.

Way to spongy and you get used to it as long as you don't drive another vehicle.

That is what is happening OP you are hitting the gas at the same time.
Freaked me out.. Took a bit to figure it out after the second time.

I’m told you can adjust the brake pedal up so you can’t depress both at once, but I never checked it out. I just move the foot. Only 11W but big enough when you pivot on the heel!

 

[P. A. Schilke]

This happened too me twice in a hard braking situation when I first got mine.
It is because of the soft break pedal..

I had just driven a escape and you barley touched the break pedal and it stops. Very touchy.
I had a situation where someone cut off the guy in front and he locked it up.
I hit the break on my Ranger and because the brake is so soft and goes so far down my foot would clip the gas.
The long travel distance of the break pedal is a issue. Took so long to get the truck to stop I hit harder on the break and clipped the gas pedal

My Colorado the break never gets down to where the gas is so no issue. The break pedal on the ranger goes so far down you can clip the gas pedal. I have big feet so it makes it even more of a issue.

Way to spongy and you get used to it as long as you don't drive another vehicle.

That is what is happening OP you are hitting the gas at the same time.
Freaked me out.. Took a bit to figure it out after the second time.

HI Shred5,

A back story... 1990 Aerostar All Wheel Drive...My program... There was a terrible moan in the vehicle which I determined via my Fast Fourier Transform Analyzer to be 2nd order powertrain bending. With a Engine/Transmission/transfer case, the frequency was in the city driving ranger. So I headed out to Livernois to fab up some braces that would brace the transfer case to the transmission bellhouse/ engine Rear Face of Block. It was dramatic improvement, so to do a peer review to make sure, I handed the prototype off to a fellow who was the supervisor of NVH analysis. He drove the Aerostar and was so impressed he got his boss (also my boss) to come for a drive. Both of them agreed that I had solved the problem and we could refine the cobble job into a production system. The way back from the Dearborn Test Track it started to rain, and the manager didn't want get wet, so my peer, Dick K. pulled the prototype into the Executive Garage of Building1, Truck Operations. This was standard operating procedure for brief stops in bad weather. Boss exits the vehicle and Dick lifts his foot off the brake and the vehicle rockets straight forward into the basement wall, splitting two service employees who ware standing in the garage (they service the big wig's vehicles). The crash was so huge that the prototype was toast. What happened? Dick said he was standing on the brake but the vehicle overrode his foot. Dick was hurt in the crash, with a bum knee from hitting the dash. So the vehicle was towed to the scrap yard and impounded for investigation. i was able to remove my bracing I had fabricated at Livernois but my prototype was now toast... Safety did a thorough investigation and finally determined Dick's 13W feet hit the brake and gas pedal at the same time and the result was the Aerostar went to Wide Open Throttle.

There was a redesign to increase the spacing of the brake pedal to the accelerator pedal and an increase of what we call "lift off" from the gas pedal to the brake pedal.... BTW...the Audi 5000 was under investigation for sudden accelerations at this time so Ford was sensitive to this investigation....

Okay...Driving prototypes is a "glamorous" deal, but not without its dangers..Eh?

Best,
Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retired

 

[Ranger Boyd]

HI Shred5,

A back story... 1990 Aerostar All Wheel Drive...My program... There was a terrible moan in the vehicle which I determined via my Fast Fourier Transform Analyzer to be 2nd order powertrain bending. With a Engine/Transmission/transfer case, the frequency was in the city driving ranger. So I headed out to Livernois to fab up some braces that would brace the transfer case to the transmission bellhouse/ engine Rear Face of Block. It was dramatic improvement, so to do a peer review to make sure, I handed the prototype off to a fellow who was the supervisor of NVH analysis. He drove the Aerostar and was so impressed he got his boss (also my boss) to come for a drive. Both of them agreed that I had solved the problem and we could refine the cobble job into a production system. The way back from the Dearborn Test Track it started to rain, and the manager didn't want get wet, so my peer, Dick K. pulled the prototype into the Executive Garage of Building1, Truck Operations. This was standard operating procedure for brief stops in bad weather. Boss exits the vehicle and Dick lifts his foot off the brake and the vehicle rockets straight forward into the basement wall, splitting two service employees who ware standing in the garage (they service the big wig's vehicles). The crash was so huge that the prototype was toast. What happened? Dick said he was standing on the brake but the vehicle overrode his foot. Dick was hurt in the crash, with a bum knee from hitting the dash. So the vehicle was towed to the scrap yard and impounded for investigation. i was able to remove my bracing I had fabricated at Livernois but my prototype was now toast... Safety did a thorough investigation and finally determined Dick's 13W feet hit the brake and gas pedal at the same time and the result was the Aerostar went to Wide Open Throttle.

There was a redesign to increase the spacing of the brake pedal to the accelerator pedal and an increase of what we call "lift off" from the gas pedal to the brake pedal.... BTW...the Audi 5000 was under investigation for sudden accelerations at this time so Ford was sensitive to this investigation....

Okay...Driving prototypes is a "glamorous" deal, but not without its dangers..Eh?

Best,
Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retired

 

[Ranger Boyd]

Thanks Phil! I feel a little better about hitting both pedals at once! Is there any pedal adjustment or do we have to retrain the drivers. Like me!

 

[shred5]

HI Shred5,

A back story... 1990 Aerostar All Wheel Drive...My program... There was a terrible moan in the vehicle which I determined via my Fast Fourier Transform Analyzer to be 2nd order powertrain bending. With a Engine/Transmission/transfer case, the frequency was in the city driving ranger. So I headed out to Livernois to fab up some braces that would brace the transfer case to the transmission bellhouse/ engine Rear Face of Block. It was dramatic improvement, so to do a peer review to make sure, I handed the prototype off to a fellow who was the supervisor of NVH analysis. He drove the Aerostar and was so impressed he got his boss (also my boss) to come for a drive. Both of them agreed that I had solved the problem and we could refine the cobble job into a production system. The way back from the Dearborn Test Track it started to rain, and the manager didn't want get wet, so my peer, Dick K. pulled the prototype into the Executive Garage of Building1, Truck Operations. This was standard operating procedure for brief stops in bad weather. Boss exits the vehicle and Dick lifts his foot off the brake and the vehicle rockets straight forward into the basement wall, splitting two service employees who ware standing in the garage (they service the big wig's vehicles). The crash was so huge that the prototype was toast. What happened? Dick said he was standing on the brake but the vehicle overrode his foot. Dick was hurt in the crash, with a bum knee from hitting the dash. So the vehicle was towed to the scrap yard and impounded for investigation. i was able to remove my bracing I had fabricated at Livernois but my prototype was now toast... Safety did a thorough investigation and finally determined Dick's 13W feet hit the brake and gas pedal at the same time and the result was the Aerostar went to Wide Open Throttle.

There was a redesign to increase the spacing of the brake pedal to the accelerator pedal and an increase of what we call "lift off" from the gas pedal to the brake pedal.... BTW...the Audi 5000 was under investigation for sudden accelerations at this time so Ford was sensitive to this investigation....

Okay...Driving prototypes is a "glamorous" deal, but not without its dangers..Eh?

Best,
Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retired

Ouch. That is not good, hate to see someone get hurt. I remember the Aerostar.

Yea mine are only size 12 or sometimes 11.5 depending on brand.

So you are saying the brake and the gas may be too close.
I could see where it could be a issue for sure and moving them farther apart would help solve the issue.
Ranger does not feel any closer than my other vehicles. Maybe they are. I have never done it on another car or truck ever.
I do think it has something to do with how far down the break pedal travels but moving them farther apart it would not matter how far it traveled.
I guess they need to at least be a size 13 apart.
I have changed the way I break but when you have to react fast.

 

[P. A. Schilke]

Thanks Phil! I feel a little better about hitting both pedals at once! Is there any pedal adjustment or do we have to retrain the drivers. Like me!

Hi Boyd,

I am not aware of any pedal adjustment for just the brake pedal...there are adjustments on some vehicles for the pedal package, but not individual pedals, so may be retraining may be in order.... As a former racecar driver I loved the pedals together for heal and toe. Operating three pedals with only two feet... I made sure the old Ranger with manual transmission could be heal and towed. We never had sudden acceleration because the pedal spacing was adjusted...I spent quite a bit time to get it right, but most if not all Vehicle Engineering employees are not race car drivers.

Left foot brakers are the bane of vehicle design...especially in old age. Another quick back story...We have a very nice service organization here in Green Valley, called Friends in Deed. The supply used medical equipment like canes, wheel chairs for us old farts in need of temporary devices. This fellow pulls up to the building in a handicapped space and proceeds to rocket into the front window over the parking bumper.
He hits the couch for folks waiting to be helped...Fortunately, the old folks on the couch were {like James Bond...Shaken but not stirred) okay.

So repairs to the store front were implemented. Two weeks later the same fellow pulled into the same parking space with the same result, he crashed through the same now newly repaired store front once again. Court took his driver's license this time....Sheesh!

This repeated with another person who drove through the Safeway Supermarket front wall where the Starbucks was located, and did the same thing after repairs, so now at Safeway, there are HUGE YELLOW bollards lining the parking in front of the store...

Best,
Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retired

 

[Ranger Boyd]

Hi Boyd,

I am not aware of any pedal adjustment for just the brake pedal...there are adjustments on some vehicles for the pedal package, but not individual pedals, so may be retraining may be in order.... As a former racecar driver I loved the pedals together for heal and toe. Operating three pedals with only two feet... I made sure the old Ranger with manual transmission could be heal and towed. We never had sudden acceleration because the pedal spacing was adjusted...I spent quite a bit time to get it right, but most if not all Vehicle Engineering employees are not race car drivers.

Left foot brakers are the bane of vehicle design...especially in old age. Another quick back story...We have a very nice service organization here in Green Valley, called Friends in Deed. The supply used medical equipment like canes, wheel chairs for us old farts in need of temporary devices. This fellow pulls up to the building in a handicapped space and proceeds to rocket into the front window over the parking bumper.
He hits the couch for folks waiting to be helped...Fortunately, the old folks on the couch were {like James Bond...Shaken but not stirred) okay.

So repairs to the store front were implemented. Two weeks later the same fellow pulled into the same parking space with the same result, he crashed through the same now newly repaired store front once again. Court took his driver's license this time....Sheesh!

This repeated with another person who drove through the Safeway Supermarket front wall where the Starbucks was located, and did the same thing after repairs, so now at Safeway, there are HUGE YELLOW bollards lining the parking in front of the store...

Best,
Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retired

After a rash of vehicles doing the same thing here in Westport Connecticut bollards wee put.up in front of municipal building, strip mall, medical building etc.... Lots of folks driving around with a turn signal going all day!. As I said, when I was breaking at a stop sign or light, just as I thought I was going to come to a stop that Eco Boost kicked in and I nearly soiled myself. Scary!

 

[Rob R]

I was looking to see if there was a problem like that I have had my truck do this to me twice now but not real bad.. It almost seems like the back pressure from the turbo mixes with some fuel residual and it surges just a bit... could that be the same issue you guys seem to be having or not... Curious??

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