PPE Deep Pan

[ctechbob]

Never been a Scamoil guy and never will be. It is all over priced for what it is to begin with. Also you really have to be careful if it doesn't meet specifications

I'm ambivalent towards them. I don't use them, but I think if you get a good price on it, it is decent enough oil, just don't think they're the end-all be-all.

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[IRISHTREMOR]

Did a little more research and found that correct Amsoil isn’t ULV rated. I just ordered 12 qts off Summit of the Valvoline ULV Synthetic. Should be here Wednesday. Hopefully knock this out on Thursday and be good for another 30k

 

[Grumpaw]

The only ULV rated trans fluid I've been able to find is the Motorcraft and the Valvoline....
May be others but if you google ULV, only those 2 come up.
And guess who makes the Motorcraft......Valvoline Industries..

 

[TJC]

And I am convinced the formulation of both Motorcraft and Valvoline are either low or missing important additives. Transmission fluid should last longer than 5K miles!

I started having transmissions issues at 5K miles (the first 12K were 90% long distance highway miles) and they grew steadily worse until at 20K I was desperate enough to contemplate unloading the truck. I had already purchased the MBS FitzStick, and the PPE pan hoping that changing the fluid would help, and told my wife (who wanted me to unload the lemon) to give me one more chance to correct the problem. I promised her that if this last effort failed that I would sell the truck this summer.

I also took the advice of ctechbob to add in LubeGard Platinum (10 oz). Since changing the fluid and adding LubeGard Platinum I have had 2000 trouble free miles since. And the only gear that I could still feel the shift was 4th. I drove the truck today. and even 4th was now shifting smooth as silk.

I will be installing the PPE deep pan, and I will be changing the transmission fluid much more often than the schedule calls for, probably as frequent as every 20K miles, but even sooner if I notice even a hint or hiccup in the transmission. And LubeGard Platinum is going in with each change.

BTW, the fluid that came out was black, not even a hint of red. My 2003 Maxima, and my 2005 Ranger fluid easily went 50K and was only slightly brown at the fluid change.

Maybe it is that the transmission is simply hard on fluid, or maybe it is poor quailty fluid specs. or maybe a combination of both. But it doesn't matter now that I have stumbled on a solution. My truck is 4 years old and only has 20K miles on it. And 12K went on it very quickly as I was forced to travel a great deal the first year of ownership. This hints at my complete lack of trust in the truck up until recently.

You can do a lost worse than changing the fluid and dropping in 10 Oz of LubeGard Platinum.

 

[Grumpaw]

And I am convinced the formulation of both Motorcraft and Valvoline are either low or missing important additives. Transmission fluid should last longer than 5K miles!

I started having transmissions issues at 5K miles (the first 12K were 90% long distance highway miles) and they grew steadily worse until at 20K I was desperate enough to contemplate unloading the truck. I had already purchased the MBS FitzStick, and the PPE pan hoping that changing the fluid would help, and told my wife (who wanted me to unload the lemon) to give me one more change to correct the problem. I promised her that if this last effort failed that I would sell the truck this summer.

I also took the advice of ctechbob to add in LubeGard Platinum (10 oz). Sincew changing the fluid and adding LubeGard Platinum I have had 2000 trouble free miles since. And the only gear that I could still feel the shift was 4th. I drove the truck today. and even 4th was now shifting smooth as silk.

I will be installing the PPE deep pan, and I will be changing the transmission fluid much more often than the schedule calls for, probably as frequent as every 20K miles, but even sooner if I notice even a hint or hiccup in the transmission. And LubeGard Platinum is going in with each change.

BTW, the fluid that came out was black, not even a hint of red. My 2003 Maxima, and my 2005 Ranger fluid easily went 50K and was only slightly brown at the fluid change.

Maybe it is that the transmission is simply hard on fluid, or maybe it is poor quailty fluid specs. or maybe a combination of both. But it doesn't matter now that I have stumbled on a solution. My truck is 4 years old and only has 20K miles on it. And 12K went on it very quickly as I was forced to travel a great deal the first year of ownership. This hints at my complete lack of trust in the truck up until recently.

You can do a lost worse than changing the fluid and dropping in 10 Oz of LubeGard Platinum.

A few weeks ago I talked at length with a Ford Master Tech at a dealership. He told me that there is nothing wrong with the ULV fluid when it gets dark early....it's the nature of the full synthetic to turn very dark, sometimes within a few hundred miles.
Also, if your interested, I have a Mishimoto Deep Pan for sale in the classified.

 

[TJC]

A few weeks ago I talked at length with a Ford Master Tech at a dealership. He told me that there is nothing wrong with the ULV fluid when it gets dark early....it's the nature of the full synthetic to turn very dark, sometimes within a few hundred miles.
Also, if your interested, I have a Mishimoto Deep Pan for sale in the classified.

Not to be too sarcastic, but....

There's nothing wrong with Engine Oil or Power Steering Fluid when it turns black either. And "All that metal in the transmission pan is normal."

I no longer trust Ford's Maintenance Schedule. And I stopped trusting dealership services in 1978.

- "No need to change transmission fluid for the life of the transmission"
Result - Ford dealerships backed up for months rebuilding and/or swapping transmissions

Driveshaft thunks and shudders - "They all do it. It is working as designed."
Result - Replacing entire driveshaft as it has no lubrication points, and a sloppy center bearing

Your master tech may be correct. And my situation may be an anomaly.

But Tom Woods makes a wonderfully strong driveshaft that got rid of the shudder and thunks, and smoothed out my driving experience.

And it's only coincidence that my transmission was severely misbehaving and the fluid was black as coal. And another coincidence when I changed it at 20K and added LubeGard Platinum to the mix that it is now functioning normally for the first time in 15K miles.

If I had not acted, the life of my transmission would have been 30K at best. As it is I wonder how much unnecessary wear has already occurred on the clutch plates.

One last thought, why dye the fluid red if it is just going to turn black immediately. Of course the owner will never know the color because the transmission is maintenance free....

however short that life may be.

Thanks for the offer of the pan, but I already have a PPE deep pan on the shelf ready to go in.

 

[Grumpaw]

Not to be too sarcastic, but....

There's nothing wrong with Engine Oil or Power Steering Fluid when it turns black either. And "All that metal in the transmission pan is normal."

I no longer trust Ford's Maintenance Schedule. And I stopped trusting dealership services in 1978.

- "No need to change transmission fluid for the life of the transmission"
Result - Ford dealerships backed up for months rebuilding and/or swapping transmissions

Driveshaft thunks and shudders - "They all do it. It is working as designed."
Result - Replacing entire driveshaft as it has no lubrication points, and a sloppy center bearing

Your master tech may be correct. And my situation may be an anomaly.

But Tom Woods makes a wonderfully strong driveshaft that got rid of the shudder and thunks, and smoothed out my driving experience.

And it's only coincidence that my transmission was severely misbehaving and the fluid was black as coal. And another coincidence when I changed it at 20K and added LubeGard Platinum to the mix that it is now functioning normally for the first time in 15K miles.

If I had not acted, the life of my transmission would have been 30K at best. As it is I wonder how much unnecessary wear has already occurred on the clutch plates.

One last thought, why dye the fluid red if it is just going to turn black immediately. Of course the owner will never know the color because the transmission is maintenance free....

however short that life may be.

Thanks for the offer of the pan, but I already have a PPE deep pan on the shelf ready to go in.

Don't misunderstand me...I am not advocating sticking to Ford's recommendation for mileage on the tranny fluid. I'm coming up on 25,000 miles and changing then, along with the trans second addition of LubeGuard.
Just giving info that I was given about the color of the fluid. Personally I wouldn't care if it were colored pink, green or purple with yellow stripes....I'd still change it early as I tow a heavy trailer.
Haven't had any problems with my tranny, and thats with half my mileage towing a 7000 lb trailer, in spring, summer (95 degree temps) and fall.

 

[ctechbob]

The only ULV rated trans fluid I've been able to find is the Motorcraft and the Valvoline....
May be others but if you google ULV, only those 2 come up.
And guess who makes the Motorcraft......Valvoline Industries..

Actually, the last I looked, I think it was Phillips that did the blending for them.

Either way. There's a handful of them, but only 3 that seem to be readily available.

Motorcraft
Dexron
Valvoline

Seems you can get those three anywhere. HPL is also blending a ULV, but it is terribly expensive, although it is a boutique fluid that is probably the best of the bunch.

Phillips and Kendall both have their Versatrans ULV, although I've never seen it in the wild.

Klondike makes one if you're in Canada and can put your hands on it.

Liqui Moly has one as well, but I've never been able to find it in stock.

 

[Grumpaw]

Actually, the last I looked, I think it was Phillips that did the blending for them.

Either way. There's a handful of them, but only 3 that seem to be readily available.

Motorcraft
Dexron
Valvoline

Seems you can get those three anywhere. HPL is also blending a ULV, but it is terribly expensive, although it is a boutique fluid that is probably the best of the bunch.

Phillips and Kendall both have their Versatrans ULV, although I've never seen it in the wild.

Klondike makes one if you're in Canada and can put your hands on it.

Liqui Moly has one as well, but I've never been able to find it in stock.

I guess whoever throws the lowest bid for a product that meets their spec's gets the contract. But when it's on sale at Napa, the Valvoline is half of the Motorcraft. Last time it was I got 3 cases (6 in a case).
Since I'm keeping the OE pan I plan to suck 6 quarts out via the Fitzstick, and replace with new, along with the LubeGuard. See if doing that every 15-20,000 miles will keep it in shape.
Probably drop the pan for a filter somewhere along the line at 2nd or 3rd suckout.

 

[ctechbob]

I guess whoever throws the lowest bid for a product that meets their spec's gets the contract. But when it's on sale at Napa, the Valvoline is half of the Motorcraft. Last time it was I got 3 cases (6 in a case).
Since I'm keeping the OE pan I plan to suck 6 quarts out via the Fitzstick, and replace with new, along with the LubeGuard. See if doing that every 15-20,000 miles will keep it in shape.
Probably drop the pan for a filter somewhere along the line at 2nd or 3rd suckout.

Didn't realize you were trying the LG as well.

 

[Grumpaw]

Didn't realize you were trying the LG as well.

Threw a bottle in before our last trip towing....ran down to Boone NC in 95 degree heat. Couldn't really tell any difference, but "It Couldn't Hurt" !!!!!!
I'll use it again with some new fluid......"It Couldn't Hurt" !!!!!

 

[TJC]

Don't misunderstand me...I am not advocating sticking to Ford's recommendation for mileage on the tranny fluid. I'm coming up on 25,000 miles and changing then, along with the trans second addition of LubeGuard.
Just giving info that I was given about the color of the fluid. Personally I wouldn't care if it were colored pink, green or purple with yellow stripes....I'd still change it early as I tow a heavy trailer.
Haven't had any problems with my tranny, and thats with half my mileage towing a 7000 lb trailer, in spring, summer (95 degree temps) and fall.

Yeah I know. I heard someone else make the same point. My statement wasn't meant to be personal. But these transmission issues that I was experiencing had me in fits. I dumped a lot of $$ in this truck and it was beginning to feel like a money pit! I'm still gun shy, and it is going to have to be reliable for several thousand miles before I began to trust it again.

I watched the engine tear down video in another thread and it appears to be a major effort to simply change the water pump. That translates into high $$ service.

I'm still recovering from a two year nightmare.

 

[diesel924]

I watched the engine tear down video in another thread and it appears to be a major effort to simply change the water pump. That translates into high $$ service.

I'm still recovering from a two year nightmare.

Book time for a water pump replacement is 2.5 hours with no special tools needed. Not really a major effort.

 

[Frenchy]

Not to be too sarcastic, but....

There's nothing wrong with Engine Oil or Power Steering Fluid when it turns black either. And "All that metal in the transmission pan is normal."

I no longer trust Ford's Maintenance Schedule. And I stopped trusting dealership services in 1978.

- "No need to change transmission fluid for the life of the transmission"
Result - Ford dealerships backed up for months rebuilding and/or swapping transmissions

Driveshaft thunks and shudders - "They all do it. It is working as designed."
Result - Replacing entire driveshaft as it has no lubrication points, and a sloppy center bearing

Your master tech may be correct. And my situation may be an anomaly.

But Tom Woods makes a wonderfully strong driveshaft that got rid of the shudder and thunks, and smoothed out my driving experience.

And it's only coincidence that my transmission was severely misbehaving and the fluid was black as coal. And another coincidence when I changed it at 20K and added LubeGard Platinum to the mix that it is now functioning normally for the first time in 15K miles.

If I had not acted, the life of my transmission would have been 30K at best. As it is I wonder how much unnecessary wear has already occurred on the clutch plates.

One last thought, why dye the fluid red if it is just going to turn black immediately. Of course the owner will never know the color because the transmission is maintenance free....

however short that life may be.

Thanks for the offer of the pan, but I already have a PPE deep pan on the shelf ready to go in.

As unhappy as you may be, I can promise you it is not a Fluid Problem. Ford has a Bulletin for an update with the transmission for some of the shifting issues with the Valve Body and the Programming. If memory serves me right, I had a weird issue in the first 5,000 miles where the truck wanted to bounce between 3rd and 7th simply by touching and releasing the throttle. I was working at a Ford Dealer at the time and spoke with the transmission tech there. It was something new to him and he suggested clearing the transmission learn. I did just that and never had an issue since.

Now when it comes to when to change the fluid? I'm not going to lie that I like the idea of changing it every 30,000 miles. Nissan has recommended that schedule on both Automatic and Manual Transmissions since the dawn of time. It shows to be a great way to keep a vehicle running for a long time.

For you not wanting to trust the dealership since that early of a time, perhaps you need to find a different dealer. Also if you clearly have no confidence in Ford, why do you keep buying them? Just curious ?

 

[TJC]

Presently I am ecstatic about the truck, but my guard is up. After 15K miles of "transmission trauma" I am still very cautious. But I am delighted that the issues appear to be resolved.

A little history is in order... The truck began to misbeahve at 5K miles, but it was rare. It progressively worsened. At 12K I took the truck to the dealer. Working as designed they said... no problem found. Those rough shifts are common, all the Rangers shift that way. I never went back.

Since I have cleared and reset the "learn" tables several times, and went through the learning protocol outlined in the service manual after each reset. Temporarily better, but would grwo steadily worse over time.

No Joy.

Got to where it would hold on 1 first coming to a stop, then jerk out to neutral.

I turned off the auto learn tables and all hell broke loose. The solenoids were sticking and slow to activate. Turned auto learn back on and went back though the learn protocols and things returned to the normal funky shifting, not shifting, not releasing when stopping erratic behavior.

Some days almost normal, others days simply crazy.

Frenchy, there is no way on God's green earth that you will convince me that it wasn't the fluid that was the fluid change and LubeGard didn't correct the problem. The only day I drove the truck all winter, I started it up, let it idle while collecting my wife and we pulled out the driveway. Driving at 20 mph, the solenoids shifted so slowly that I could actually hear them energize and begin to move, taking 5- 10 seconds to complete the transition and shift to the next gear. I got to 6th before stopping the truck, and retrying using a very slow acceleration so as not to damage anything. The exact same thing occurred. I turned around and parked it for the winter. BTW, The truck is garaged and temps in the garage stay much higher than outdoors. It was balmy day in the mid 50's. Not cold at all!

I had been discussing this with cetchbob who first turned me on to LubGard. I went all winter and into the spring before finally giving it a try. In fact I was so skeptical I refused to try it. ctechbob didn't push, just stated I should give it a try, and I told him I worried that Ford would not honor my extended warranty if I went for it.

I was finally so desperate for a fix that I gave it a try. I moved the truck to my work garage and I let the truck sit over night. The next morning I pulled 7.5 quarts out via the Fitzstick. I replaced that fluid witn Motorcraft ULV and 10oz of LubeGard. Started the truck up and took it for a spin.

ALL SYMPYOMS GONE. ALL OF THEM.

And it has been that way now for 2K miles. It may start acting up again at any moment, but I am becoming more confident each day. Presently I can't feel any shift except 4th, amd it is no harsher than what I feel in my 2005 Ranger. The other 9 are all exceptionally smooth. 4th appears to be getting better over time.

The ONLY thing that has changed is the transmission fluid and the addition of LubeGard.

I've been around the block on automobiles, Swapped my first engine at 13 (entirely by myself).

Built and rebuilt many different varieties. of engines, from a Chevy Corvair Spider (a really fun car), to small block Chevy V8s, to Ford 200CID straight inline 6 cyl. Audi 4 cycl, Oldsmobile 350 v8 Diesels.

I purchased that Olds new and blew head gaskets twice in 2 years, first time covered under warranty, the 2nd time out of warranty and I did the work. After a year or so I decided it was unreliable and went back to the dealer of purchase wishing to trade it in for a new model. Not a single GM dealer would accept it on trade. They actually laughed at me to my face! 24K miles on it, garaged and looking new. I vowed not to puchace a GM ever again, and have not purchased a GM vehicle since... and I will never purchase a GM vehicle again.

I went foreign for the next 20 years until 1999 and all models were extremely reliable. The last was a 2003 Maxima that I just gifted to a nephew. It looks new and runs great.

This is when I purchased my first Ranger used, a 98 2.3l that I drove for several years before giving it to my Dad. I had absolutely no problems with it. Bought my 2005 Ranger Edge 4.0:v6 4x4 new, and I am still driving it. I love this truck. Simple Reliable rugged transportation.

Bought the 2020 Ranger figuring it would be my last Ranger, and under the impression it would have the reliability of the first two and that I could still be driving it until it is time to give up my keys. (I'm pushing 70.)

But for added insurance, I rebuilt the 2005 from the ground up Everything except the diffs and transfer case, and PS and Fuel pumps (I just replaced the fuel pump) were replaced.

EVERYTHING! The truck is in outstanding shape, and I trust it to go anywhere.

So that is my Ford purchase history. And you are correct, I have purchased my last Ford unless I see a dramatic improvement in quality control.

I may take it in for the TSB if they change the shift patterns to a slightly higher rpm. But I don't want them touching the transmission as it is operating fine for the first time in 2 years.

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