Think I Threw a Rod....

[Langwilliams]

He may not be entitled to a core refund...if the replaced part can't be refurbished he may not be.

I agree it's his truck an if he wants his stuff reinstalled an waives going warranty compliant it should be his choice.

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[AzScorpion]

A lot of people here think Ford has to do this or that. They do not. He violated the terms of the warranty and a component (engine) failed. I’m sure everything is a pretty shade of overheated blue. I highly doubt Ford or any other manufacturer has lost a court case when the the warranty was so clearly violated. They don’t need to “prove” or provide anything.

The only thing I would think Ford should do is provide pictures and not just say "the mods caused this". Other than that Ford has nothing more to do with it and it's now up to 5 Star who warrantied this. Personally I don't know why the OP wants to keep throwing money out the window when he paid for this warranty? Something smells rotten in Denmark because this really doesn't make much sense. But I'm not one to sit around and watch grass grow, I'd be on the phone with 5 Star religiously making sure they're going to hold up their end of this.

 

[Rp930]

Not accurate. Everything you say is correct but they do have to tell him Exactly why the claim is denied and for what reason. Ford provides this to the dealer and they should in turn provide it to the customer. They DO have a basis to deny the claim from what has been posted in the last 55 pages but until it is in writing, on Ford letterhead, the fat lady hasn't sung.

Unfortunately it is accurate. I was a rep for a different manufacturer for 20 years and denied my share of failures. I never once was asked or was required to provide my findings on “Company” letterhead to a customer. In fact, legal likely would have said no to a letter.

Lets say a rod broke. Did it break because it was over stressed or because it was poorly manufactured. Who‘s going to do the analysis and pay for it? Plenty of other engines haven’t had a rod failure so a part failure from manufacture is unlikely. So then it just becomes an argument and the argument doesn’t hold up when multiple modifications are made. They will document the Hell out of the modifications and let you go to court if you think you have a case. Who do YOU think will win?

 

[Strokerduster]

Unfortunately it is accurate. I was a rep for a different manufacturer for 20 years and denied my share of failures. I never once was asked or was required to provide my findings on “Company” letterhead to a customer. In fact, legal likely would have said no to a letter.

Lets say a rod broke. Did it break because it was over stressed or because it was poorly manufactured. Who‘s going to do the analysis and pay for it? Plenty of other engines haven’t had a rod failure so a part failure from manufacture is unlikely. So then it just becomes an argument and the argument doesn’t hold up when multiple modifications are made. They will document the Hell out of the modifications and let you go to court if you think you have a case. Who do YOU think will win?

I'm not arguing the denial at all just the process. Having been a Service Manager at a FORD dealer and seeing how THEY do it many times, I have my doubts about all this. The question that Ford always asked was "can you be 100% sure that the XXX caused the failure"? Their denial is provided to the dealer and can be provided to the owner in writing. The question I have for you is what did the OP receive for his tear down money other than what a service writer may or may not have told him?

 

[Rp930]

I'm not arguing the denial at all just the process. Having been a Service Manager at a FORD dealer and seeing how THEY do it many times, I have my doubts about all this. The question that Ford always asked was "can you be 100% sure that the XXX caused the failure"? Their denial is provided to the dealer and can be provided to the owner in writing. The question I have for you is what did the OP receive for his tear down money other than what a service writer may or may not have told him?

Well I certainly didn’t rep for Ford and can only relate my personal experience as a manufacturer rep. I’m sure we all worked differently.

As Ranger Pride and others have asked where are the pictures? If I paid for a tear down someone should had led me to my vehicle or engine and at least showed me the carnage. At that time I would have taken a hand full of pictures with my cell phone and asked for their opinion. Doesn’t mean they would give me an opinion. On the flip side I authorized repairs when the dealer declined if I thought the modification had nothing to do with it, a lot of time revolving around track use. This one would have been a flat NO based on what I think transpired in the last 50+ pages and of course I would have been sent pictures and talked to the dealer.

I can tell you one thing, FORD must be a lot less careful with letters on letterhead than we were.

 

[Strokerduster]

Well I certainly didn’t rep for Ford and can only relate my personal experience as a manufacturer rep. I’m sure we all worked differently.

As Ranger Pride and others have asked where are the pictures? If I paid for a tear down someone should had led me to my vehicle or engine and at least showed me the carnage. At that time I would have taken a hand full of pictures with my cell phone and asked for their opinion. Doesn’t mean they would give me an opinion. On the flip side I authorized repairs when the dealer declined if I thought the modification had nothing to do with it, a lot of time revolving around track use. This one would have been a flat NO based on what I think transpired in the last 50+ pages and of course I would have been sent pictures and talked to the dealer.

I can tell you one thing, FORD must be a lot less careful with letters on letterhead than we were.

I'm not arguing the denial at all, just the process. Reps these days are not like you remember. Most (not all)are fresh out of college, late 20's, frequently female (no it doesn't make a difference) and come with marketing experience rather than engineering. They do not come with the SOLE AUTHORITY to approve or deny a claim such as this. They do have the ability to advocate on your behalf with Ford and do have pull. Neither they, the dealer, or the tech doing the tear down have training in the analysis required or can do anything but gather all the data for Ford Warranty. Ford Warranty makes the decision based on everything they request and are provided. They provide the dealer with their finding and reasons for it in writing. It can be appealed if you have reason to disagree but their finding is final. It's their warranty. I've known reps of other mfgs and seems to be about the same. Your experience may differ.

 

[Strokerduster]

He may not be entitled to a core refund...if the replaced part can't be refurbished he may not be.

I agree it's his truck an if he wants his stuff reinstalled an waives going warranty compliant it should be his choice.

Something to think about. If you are buying a NEW engine from a company that can and does manufacture the complete engine from scratch, why is there a core charge? Ford does not rebuild the engine, they have companies that are authorized to rebuild for Ford, example: AER. Carry it one step forward, why is there a core charge on a new aluminum rim when Ford only sells em new and not rebuilt. I know the answer, care to guess for shits and grins.....

 

[Rp930]

I'm not arguing the denial at all, just the process. Reps these days are not like you remember. Most (not all)are fresh out of college, late 20's, frequently female (no it doesn't make a difference) and come with marketing experience rather than engineering. They do not come with the SOLE AUTHORITY to approve or deny a claim such as this. They do have the ability to advocate on your behalf with Ford and do have pull. Neither they, the dealer, or the tech doing the tear down have training in the analysis required or can do anything but gather all the data for Ford Warranty. Ford Warranty makes the decision based on everything they request and are provided. They provide the dealer with their finding and reasons for it in writing. It can be appealed if you have reason to disagree but their finding is final. It's their warranty. I've known reps of other mfgs and seems to be about the same. Your experience may differ.

A really good observation. In my day, only left 2 years ago, I had sole authority for my Region. I could see the writing on the wall as they hired younger with less experience. They no longer have the full authority I did.

 

[Langwilliams]

Something to think about. If you are buying a NEW engine from a company that can and does manufacture the complete engine from scratch, why is there a core charge? Ford does not rebuild the engine, they have companies that are authorized to rebuild for Ford, example: AER. Carry it one step forward, why is there a core charge on a new aluminum rim when Ford only sells em new and not rebuilt. I know the answer, care to guess for shits and grins.....

I thought of that too but I don't know the reason. They may have a use or need for them like testing

 

[Strokerduster]

I thought of that too but I don't know the reason. They may have a use or need for them like testing

Nope, they have mounds of em to play with. Another guess?

 

[Langwilliams]

Nope, they have mounds of em to play with. Another guess?

They can do it

 

[Washashore]

They can do it

To keep them out of remanufacturers hands, otherwise why would they have core charges for damaged bumper covers and taillights...

 

[Strokerduster]

They can do it

That's true. They use it as a way to control the aftermarket of rebuilt items. The rim as an example, if they charge a core they get to keep the old one and the people who rebuild rims are limited on where and and time it takes to acquire product to rebuild. In that example, If the rebuilder takes a damaged rim, repairs and sells to say a bodyshop and 2 years it fails causing an accident, Ford gets sued. I have seen a reputable reman co., buy 50 new alternators from OE to get the cores to rebuild to start the process. After a few years supply is there and 1 for 1 works.

 

[Strokerduster]

To keep them out of remanufacturers hands, otherwise why would they have core charges for damaged bumper covers and taillights...

Ding Ding Ding.....

 

[Project Midnight]

One thing of many that I do not understand you state that if you take it to another dealer you will have to pay for another teardown, is it not already tore down? Pay for reinspection yes to determine the cause. Also you state that you are & willing to pay to play. Since you have why would you even consider having it rebuilt for a greater cost with a factory warranty when you don't appear to want a bone stock engine? Just thinking out loud not banging on you. ?

That’s the equation, do I rebuild it to stock, to sell it in the future?? That’s my current dilemma. My original purchase of this Ranger, was to build it up custom until the Ford Ranger Raptor came from Ford. When I buy that truck, I plan on buying the 5 Star Tune, with their “Warranty” because I believe in their tune... the decision about the dealerships, is that some dealerships will not install anything, even its from Ford Performance, unless its stock... if another dealership will install my Ford Performance exhaust, that I bought from FORD, while Mak Haik says ”no” why would I give them my business??

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