EV's... Rolling Blackouts in 115 F. Heat

[the5Gmartian]

I think like anything else, technology will evolve and solve the issue of the power grid not being able to handle everyone plugging in their EVs. That being said, i’ve been in the personal belief that I don’t think EVs are the future (at least not for the majority of people), I think Hydrogen powered cars are the answer. They make much more sense in terms of their range, pollute much less and they function essentially like our fossil fuel powered cars.

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[AzScorpion]

I think like anything else, technology will evolve and solve the issue of the power grid not being able to handle everyone plugging in their EVs. That being said, i’ve been in the personal belief that I don’t think EVs are the future (at least not for the majority of people), I think Hydrogen powered cars are the answer. They make much more sense in terms of their range, pollute much less and they function essentially like our fossil fuel powered cars.

I agree with this but remember one thing. The ones who are making the decisions don't have any common sense so more than likely the opposite will happen.

 

[Megawatt]

…….
it's going to impact electrical generation at Hoover Dam as energy consumption continues to rise in the Southwest. Get used to more rolling blackouts.

Hoover already has lost its ability to produce 25% of its rated power. They are next door to our power plant.

 

[Megawatt]

Normal price for a megawatt of electricity for purchase by the utilities is around $30. This past five days with the Western US in excessive heat warnings the price is $300/megawatt.

last year when temps got hot and CA had rolling brown outs the price was $1000 per megawatt. Same prices when Texas froze last Winter.

 

[CB750F]

Hoover already has lost its ability to produce 25% of its rated power. They are next door to our power plant.

Just brilliant to build a city in the middle of a desert.... Talk about a setup for failure.
I had lots of fun in Vegas... lol

 

[Trigganometry]

For me the “logical” path is natural gas (US has a 200 year supply untapped) and hydrogen. Between the two for carbon footprints of both combined nothing discussed will even come close for efficiency and sustainability

 

[rcairflr]

Here is my take on EV. The range will increase over time. It won't be too many years and EVs will have a range of 700-1000 miles. With that range, they become very viable even for travel in a large country like USA.
In time the grid will be fixed to add the increase usage of EV charging.
There are already quite a few charging stations, but as the need broadens more and more will be added.
Hydrogen will "NOT" be largely used for passenger cars. For long haul trucks "yes" but not passenger cars.

None of the issues around moving to EV are insurmountable, all will be well.....

 

[CB750F]

Here is my take on EV. The range will increase over time. It won't be too many years and EVs will have a range of 700-1000 miles. With that range, they become very viable even for travel in a large country like USA.
In time the grid will be fixed to add the increase usage of EV charging.
There are already quite a few charging stations, but as the need broadens more and more will be added.
Hydrogen will "NOT" be largely used for passenger cars. For long haul trucks "yes" but not passenger cars.

None of the issues around moving to EV are insurmountable, all will be well.....

Yup, see my post #14, 15 mins charging time is on deck. It will only get better. I think they are
even talking about 8 mins, so that's getting close to our pump times now.
Hydrogen seems to be having a hard time but hopefuly soon, someone will
make a breakthrough.

 

[Leftcoast]

It's been 115+ here for the past 5 days which was a record for this time of year. Last year we broke every record on the books with 53 days of 110+ degree days! These rolling blackout happened last summer in CA too so it's no surprise they're happening again. I'm all for it over time but our whole grid is archaic and needs a severe update to be able to withstand EV powered vehicles. IIRC CA wants to be fully green and EV by 2030? It's nice in theory but I think it'll take a lot longer than that for such a large state that's so mismanaged.

I laugh when one of the other smaller states rip on ours. We are the fifth largest economy on the planet. Our more stringent auto emission standards drive policy through out the US. In reality we set the pace and others just try and keep up. Are we perfect? It's far from perfect. It's a work in progress. I remember the terrible air of the 60s and 70s. The mismanagement has cleaned it up. My children only get a hint of how bad it was when an older car drives down the road. It's going to get better too even if we have to drag the rest of you kicking and screaming into the future.

rant off.

 

[myothercarizahearse]

I hate to say this but the planet is fine, a little speed bump, maybe, but were not.
Mother nature will wipe us clean & some other being will take our place in a
few 100 thousand yrs.

somebody understands but it will be us who wipe ourselves out

 

[Leftcoast]

somebody understands but it will be us who wipe ourselves out

You must be a hoot at parties.

 

[DeathRanger]

Here is my take on EV. The range will increase over time. It won't be too many years and EVs will have a range of 700-1000 miles. With that range, they become very viable even for travel in a large country like USA.
In time the grid will be fixed to add the increase usage of EV charging.
There are already quite a few charging stations, but as the need broadens more and more will be added.
Hydrogen will "NOT" be largely used for passenger cars. For long haul trucks "yes" but not passenger cars.

None of the issues around moving to EV are insurmountable, all will be well.....

why 700-1000? Current electric cars have a range of 300-ish and are making cross country trips. My 2019 ranger only gets about 350 miles on a tank so really not much more than electric vehicle.

I think 400 mile range will be more than sufficient for most people.

 

[Opusnbill7]

Yup, see my post #14, 15 mins charging time is on deck. It will only get better. I think they are
even talking about 8 mins, so that's getting close to our pump times now.
Hydrogen seems to be having a hard time but hopefuly soon, someone will
make a breakthrough.

You're right on the charging times, but the problem is the amount of energy you have to dump into the battery in that short period. Liquid fuels are very energy-dense, so as long as you can fill a reasonable volume (as we can now) in a short period, you can get a lot of energy reloaded very quickly.

If you're loading in (for example) 100 kWh of energy into a battery in 10 hours, that's 10 kW/h. A typical residential service can handle that.

If you want to load it in 15 minutes, that's 400 kW/h. In 5 minutes, it's 1200 kW/h. A typical distribution line can handle around 10 MW (or 10000 kW). So a "gas station" will have to have a dedicated distribution line from a substation for multiple "pumps" (yes there will be some diversity, but are you going to make some people wait even if the "pump" isn't taken up by someone else?)

Get ready to see a lot more electrical facilities built, and costs of charging (or electric rates), or taxes go up to subsidize all of these infrastructure costs to facilitate this fast charging.

Electric cars are great for in-town and commuting. But they're not the be-all, end-all, and they never will be without a lot of costs that we all will have to bear whether we drive one or not.

 

[AdamHarris]

Or electrical grid is kind of like an individual‘s finances: If you suddenly start making more money most people end up spending more money; however, if you suddenly make less money you figure out how to adjust and life goes on..

 

[TechnicallyReal]

Another thread where no one is actually qualified to discuss the topic but everyone has an opinion, anecdote, or second-hand knowledge on it. Not to mention the technology is changing so rapidly that most of the valid information is already irrelevant or obsolete by now, or will be by next month/year.

Since the last thread like this, an economical method of extracting lithium from salt water was developed. Who knows what will happen next week.

I'm just glad that there are people solving these problems. EV and battery technology is changing more rapidly than others, so I think we're going in the right direction. So long as we don't become complacent at a certain point.

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