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All New 2019 Ranger Closes The Year With 89,571 Total Sales; 14,473 Sales In December

Andrew

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Sure, except that they sold like 70+k of them at the price you keep saying they can't and another 10k+ after they introduced the large end of year rebates you keep saying that they can't sell without. :rolleyes: I get that some people like you and your dealer want the ranger to be cheaper. I don't see the economics working out that way and you keep dodging the question of what would make the ranger $5k (or $2k or $10k or whatever) cheaper to build than the f150. Plenty of other people seem to think that the price is reasonable and are willing to pay more at the beginning of the model year than at the end of the model year. (Which is kinda just how car sales work most of the time.)
Dude any vehicle is going to sell even the Ford Pinto sold. So your argument is kinda dumb sorry. The argument is can Ford compete for the 1 spot being the same price as the Taco. So far that’s a big no. Look at how big of a sales jump there was when the price did drop. If your Ford and you want to grab the number 2 and compete for 1 you need to be aggressive and lower the price. If given the choice most people would go Toyota if price being the same.



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John Lyman

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Do I think the Ranger can be priced the same as the Taco yes eventually but first you need to get these truck on the road and create some buzz. Once reliability is know more people will have more confidence in the Ranger. Also the general public is not as informed as those on the forums and they do not know half this stuff. they have no idea the Ranger was still being made either.
I believe you hit the nail on the head on Ford needs to get some buzz and on the road. I went to the ford dealership to look at a F150 I had forgotten about the Ranger (only saw 1 prior and the news was a while ago). So the more Ford makes people aware of the Ranger (advertising and selling more) the more the sales will increase. Ford has a good reputation in the truck market because of the F150 so that should help with Rangers sales.
 

AzScorpion

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Do I think the Ranger can be priced the same as the Taco yes eventually but first you need to get these truck on the road and create some buzz. Once reliability is know more people will have more confidence in the Ranger. Also the general public is not as informed as those on the forums and they do not know half this stuff. they have no idea the Ranger was still being made either.

This is
definitely true! Almost every article or video I see in the comments that people are afraid of the 4 cyl turbos longevity. Most are naive and don't do their research but you're right that Ford needs to get as many of these truck out on the road and the best way to do it is big end of the year incentives. They shot themselves in the foot by leaving the market so now they have to "prove" themselves again. Flood the market with as many Rangers as they can and let the customer decide. Those of us who spend time researching know that this motor/tranny combo is already proven reliable but most people just hop on YouTube and base their decisions on a few hack videos which usually favor the Tacoma.

I can't tell you how many people have stopped my in parking lots and most had no idea the Ranger was back in production. Ford really needs to do a better job at marketing if they want to compete in the mid size truck category. I think I've only seen 1-2 rangers ads while every weekend I see tons of F150 ads. I realize that's their bread and butter but they need to get the word out that the Ranger is back.
 

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So your argument is kinda dumb sorry. The argument is can Ford compete for the 1 spot being the same price as the Taco. So far that’s a big no.
What argument is that? And who cares about the tacoma? I'm not arguing anything about the tacoma, in fact I don't really care who sells the most midsize trucks. The only "argument" as far as I'm concerned is "can ford make enough money to justify selling the current ranger". The answer seems to be yes based on the fact that they're selling a lot of them, they haven't needed to heavily discount them, and they haven't made any dramatic changes for 2020.

Look at how big of a sales jump there was when the price did drop.
Yeah, sales went up a bit. But, again, they sold like 70k of them without major discounts, then had an end of year sale to somewhat increase the sales rate on some subset of the remainder. (The big discounts didn't apply to the lariat trim.) It's not like they sold zero through october and 89k in late november and december when the discounts took off. This argument about the price being too high makes no sense if ford could sell around seventy thousand of them throughout most of the year and they feel confident enough to leave the prices alone for 2020. You're basically asking ford to walk away from what? $150M? $300M? And in return you offer...what? The opportunity to sell another 30k or 50k or 100k trucks at much lower profit margins or maybe even at loss? And brand the ranger as a bargain play right before they come out with a new model? Why on earth would they do that?

If given the choice most people would go Toyota if price being the same.
Sure, if you completely ignore all the people who didn't. (I personally wouldn't buy the toyota at any price, and I'm not the only one. The damn things are cramped and uncomfortable, I don't want their stupid sunroof, and why the hell can't I get an extended cab/standard bed on the nicer trim levels?) Ford doesn't need to convince all tacoma users to buy a ranger and they'd be idiots to spend a ton of money trying to do so.
 

Andrew

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What argument is that? And who cares about the tacoma? I'm not arguing anything about the tacoma, in fact I don't really care who sells the most midsize trucks. The only "argument" as far as I'm concerned is "can ford make enough money to justify selling the current ranger". The answer seems to be yes based on the fact that they're selling a lot of them, they haven't needed to heavily discount them, and they haven't made any dramatic changes for 2020.


Yeah, sales went up a bit. But, again, they sold like 70k of them without major discounts, then had an end of year sale to somewhat increase the sales rate on some subset of the remainder. (The big discounts didn't apply to the lariat trim.) It's not like they sold zero through october and 89k in late november and december when the discounts took off. This argument about the price being too high makes no sense if ford could sell around seventy thousand of them throughout most of the year and they feel confident enough to leave the prices alone for 2020. You're basically asking ford to walk away from what? $150M? $300M? And in return you offer...what? The opportunity to sell another 30k or 50k or 100k trucks at much lower profit margins or maybe even at loss? And brand the ranger as a bargain play right before they come out with a new model? Why on earth would they do that?


Sure, if you completely ignore all the people who didn't. (I personally wouldn't buy the toyota at any price, and I'm not the only one. The damn things are cramped and uncomfortable, I don't want their stupid sunroof, and why the hell can't I get an extended cab/standard bed on the nicer trim levels?) Ford doesn't need to convince all tacoma users to buy a ranger and they'd be idiots to spend a ton of money trying to do so.

Who cares about the Tacoma?? Really the segment leader? You don’t care who sells more?? You should cause competition makes everyone better and the buyer wins. How do you think the F150 became the leader for large trucks?? By offering the best bang for your buck and large discounts. The Ranger needs to be the same. Ford could always sell the Ranger for profit no doubt. But they were getting beat so badly by Toyota they left the market. Just look at the Nissan. It’s old as time but still sells because it’s the cheapest option. Have you had a Tacoma?? I have it’s a great truck but the engine/tranny sucks. But the aftermarket and resale value is amazing on those things. There also starting to catch up in tech offering something similar to Ford Pass and a Apple/Android auto. These are all good things. 70k trucks a year is okay but no where near what they could be selling or want to be selling to be a major player. Frontier sold almost just as much being 20 something years old. I have no idea why you think Ford is fine asking premium money for a truck when they clearly can be sold cheaper.
 

VAMike

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Who cares about the Tacoma?? Really the segment leader? You don’t care who sells more?? You should cause competition makes everyone better and the buyer wins. How do you think the F150 became the leader for large trucks??
But wait, by your logic Toyota should just stop selling the Tundra, right? If you aren't number one you just shouldn't bother? It's Highlander car logic (there can be only one!) I'm only interested in whether Ford will sell me a Ranger that I want to buy. Whether some other guy buys a Tacoma does not matter to me, nor should it.

But they were getting beat so badly by Toyota they left the market.
They didn't leave the market because of Toyota, they left the market because the market changed. To this day the Tacoma is selling 100k fewer copies per year than Ford was selling Rangers in 1999. I guess by your logic the Tacoma is a failure?

Have you had a Tacoma?? I have it’s a great truck but the engine/tranny sucks.
WHY ON EARTH WOULD I BUY A TRUCK THAT FIND TO BE CRAMPED AND UNCOMFORTABLE? (And that tacoma owners keep saying has a bad drivetrain, no less?)

But the aftermarket and resale value is amazing on those things.
Oh, right, because it's easy to dump it on someone else when you get tired of it. o_O

I have no idea why you think Ford is fine asking premium money for a truck when they clearly can be sold cheaper.
Because they have a lot of happy customers and hundreds of millions of dollars more than they would if you were in charge, making it more likely that the next time I want to buy one Ford will still be in business.
 

John Lyman

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I think at the end of the day we the consumer are the winner in this market. The Ranger making a comeback is a huge win for completion. I believe we can all agree that the completion is a little stale and in need of a shake up.
 
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Ford really needs to do a better job at marketing if they want to compete in the mid size truck category. I think I've only seen 1-2 rangers ads while every weekend I see tons of F150 ads. I realize that's their bread and butter but they need to get the word out that the Ranger is back.
At this point, I'm not sure Ford wants to compete heavily - I mean, it appears as though they are basically selling all the Rangers they are producing, and the plant that is producing them is scheduled to start building the Broncos soon. So, if they did a big push and sold way more Rangers, they might not have enough production capactiy to keep up. I don't know if the plants can go to 3 shifts or not - somewhere I thought I heard 2 shifts was the max. If so, MAP is pretty much tapped out for capacity once the Bronco starts being produced.

From public statements, they are happy with the sales where they are, and production wise, it kind of makes sense. If they started selling 20k a month, they would need to spin up a new plant somewhere to produce more Rangers - I guess that is a good problem to have, but it doesn't seem like one they want to have right now.
 

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At this point, I'm not sure Ford wants to compete heavily - I mean, it appears as though they are basically selling all the Rangers they are producing, and the plant that is producing them is scheduled to start building the Broncos soon. So, if they did a big push and sold way more Rangers, they might not have enough production capactiy to keep up. I don't know if the plants can go to 3 shifts or not - somewhere I thought I heard 2 shifts was the max. If so, MAP is pretty much tapped out for capacity once the Bronco starts being produced.

From public statements, they are happy with the sales where they are, and production wise, it kind of makes sense. If they started selling 20k a month, they would need to spin up a new plant somewhere to produce more Rangers - I guess that is a good problem to have, but it doesn't seem like one they want to have right now.
Hi Rob,

You need 4 hours a day for maintenance, so triple shifting is not possible....10 hours/6days double shifted is about the max. Not sure where MAP is at this point but likely based on volumes...probably single shift at this point.

Best,
Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
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RedlandRanger

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Hi Rob,

You need 4 hours a day for maintenance, so triple shifting is not possible....10 hours/6days double shifted is about the max. Not sure where MAP is at this point but likely based on volumes...probably single shift at this point.

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Phil Schilke
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That is kind of what I thought. Last I heard MAP was working 10 hours/6 days but don't know if they moved back off that. That doesn't seem sustainable for an extended period. It definitely was not a double shift. My understanding was the second shift will be for Bronco production when it starts, but then MAP will be at capacity. Since Ranger and Bronco share the same platform, maybe they will be getting produced at the same time on the same line?
 

P. A. Schilke

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That is kind of what I thought. Last I heard MAP was working 10 hours/6 days but don't know if they moved back off that. That doesn't seem sustainable for an extended period. It definitely was not a double shift. My understanding was the second shift will be for Bronco production when it starts, but then MAP will be at capacity. Since Ranger and Bronco share the same platform, maybe they will be getting produced at the same time on the same line?
Hi Rob,

Pretty sure Broncos and Ranger will be on the same line. probably some feed lines will be unique.

Best,
Phil Schilke
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RedlandRanger

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Hi Rob,

Pretty sure Broncos and Ranger will be on the same line. probably some feed lines will be unique.

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Phil Schilke
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Some day I'd love to tour an assembly plant. Many, many years ago my parents too me to a Ford plant in Michigan, but they were retooling (it was summertime) so all we could see was the steel plant. That was pretty amazing seeing these HUGE ingots of steel and then going thru several rollers until it was cooled and pressed to the correct thickness and rolled into a big roll. Although the steel plant was cool, I was disappointed we couldn't see the assembly line.

Someday maybe......
 

John Lyman

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If they are selling every Ranger they build within a couple of months then they are going to be very happy as they build up goodwill, brand awareness and marketing. I thought I read somewhere they were building a new/additional plant for capacity. I also feel bad for a local dealership here in the Atlanta area they are sitting with 5-9 rangers built prior to march of 2019 - I was going look at one but was like why has this been sitting since March....
 

John Lyman

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Or on second thought if they are selling all they have - this is a great marketing strategy. There will be a new Ranger probably 2021 model along with the Bronco probably being built at a new plant - so what better way to start a marketing campaign thing bring back an awesome name with a well proven truck keep supply some what low to create a buzz.
 

P. A. Schilke

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Some day I'd love to tour an assembly plant. Many, many years ago my parents too me to a Ford plant in Michigan, but they were retooling (it was summertime) so all we could see was the steel plant. That was pretty amazing seeing these HUGE ingots of steel and then going thru several rollers until it was cooled and pressed to the correct thickness and rolled into a big roll. Although the steel plant was cool, I was disappointed we couldn't see the assembly line.

Someday maybe......
Hi Rob,

The only thing you see is the final line starting about body deck area....Some of the fascinating things like the body shop, the paint line etc are really cool, but most folks only get snapshot videos I suspect that the plant will have some expansion but I am of the opinion that the next generation Ranger is on the same chassis we know and love New body maybe...It does not make sense to retool the whole plant only to do another chassis as well, but I may be wrong...

If my buddy makes it down here in late Jan, I can get him to read the PDL (Program Direction Letter) which is the framework for the Ranger Program, it will spell out if there is a new chassis as well...

Anyway...I am happy with my 2019 Ranger and will likely keep it many years...My old 2007 served well...It followed my motor home for about 97,000 miles but only showed 34,000 on the odo. I disclosed this fact to the dealer...not sure if they told the customer who purchased it. It had a shelf life on half a day after I turned it in on the 2019...

Best,
Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co Retired
 

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