Tom Woods Driveshaft ordered and installed!

[Shoran12]

I'm happy to hear that the shaft worked well for you. You know something, your post came at a funny coincidental time. Just a few days ago I was talking to a colleague about how some new products are a hit and some are a dud but we just don't know for sure until we bring the product to market. I used these Ranger shafts as an example and was saying that we may soon pull the plug on this experiment. We're still going to wait a little while and see how well these perform for people on average but we've had a couple customers recently for whom the shaft did not fix their vibrations, bringing down the average success rate. Also, when we first developed these shafts it was after hearing from people and seeing forum threads which made me think that there was a significant problem with these trucks. I thought that the few people I talked to were just the tip of the iceberg. Now, after having the shaft available for some time, I am starting to think that the 20 or so people who I've seen/heard complain of drive shaft shudders might have just been a vocal minority, not the tip of any considerable iceberg. Either that or people still have a lot of hesitancy ordering a 1-piece replacement. The point being, we haven't sold as many as I thought and probably ordered way too much inventory of parts and had too many of the flange spacer/bushings made. This one might be a dud. From a business perspective that sucks, we certainly don't like to invest money and time into new products that just sit on the shelf. But then again there is no success without trying and with enough tries comes a few failures. But then I saw your post and how enthusiastic you are about the improvement that our drive shaft made in your Truck. From a non-economic perspective, of just helping people find a solution to a problem, this becomes a bit of a quality>quantity story for me. In which when it works it works very well and people are very happy with the results. This gives me hesitation about potentially pulling it from the market.

Well if it matters any I was planning on picking one up later this year. I have a minor shudder and some droning. I will have to wait until my suspension is installed and then plan to work a an extra day or two to get the shaft. Unfortunately it’s a slow process because I want to have my truck looked at for warranty issues first, then whenever that’s done do the suspension and then the driveshaft since suspension changes may affect my measurements. I think it’s awesome that you guys offer a custom made driveshaft for the truck. From what I have read is that your driveshaft alone has made some people decide to keep a truck they would have otherwise sold. Anyway I understand from a business perspective completely but you definitely have really helped some people out a lot.

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[Shoran12]

I think it happens more than you realize. However, this is a large chunk of money and... people are not always willing to step away from that much money. Plus, there are some who are disparaging to this type of step away from the almighty Ford engineers.

I have the shudder, but its not bad enough to invest in the shaft yet, but its on my radar.

Yeah same but at some point I probably want to fix it. Today I also noticed the damn slip joint clunk when stopping. Guessing because it’s the warmest it’s been in months so that changes the viscosity of what little grease is in there.

 

[TJC]

I suspect that the slop in the driveshaft plays a role in the transmission failures we are starting to see as well.

My transmission has been behaving itself since the TW Driveshaft was installed.

It used to hang on too long coming to a stop, then disengage just as I stopped, jerking my head forward. Then when beginning to move forward at slow speeds, it would lug enough to pulse the torque on the entire drive train. Constant load is one thing, but a power load that abruptly pulses in rapid succession destroys components... and I think it originates from a sloppy loose 2 piece driveshaft that confuses the hell out of the transmission's adaptive firmware.

That's my theory.

 

[Superspirit]

I've been considering this as I have the launch shudder. however all the talk about not being able to run over 90 is holding me back. the speed limit is 75-80mph most of where I drive on the highway and I occasionally run up over 90 for a min or two while overtaking an oil field truck. if it didn't have the critical speed so low as to cause a problem I'd already have one.

 

[Shawn at Tom Wood's]

From what I have read is that your driveshaft alone has made some people decide to keep a truck they would have otherwise sold.

I've read/heard that from a couple people. Which is exactly what I mean when I talk about quality>quantity of results. It makes it feel wrong to consider discontinuing these shafts and taking the "Not my problem, buddy" approach. For the time being at least, we will continue to offer them and we will continue to monitor how well this shaft performs.

 

[navsnipe]

I have 5500 miles on my Tom Woods driveshaft. I would have sold my Ranger if this didn't fix my driveline shudder. Now I drive my truck and enjoy it. I came from a 2016 Audi Allroad so I have to remind myself it is a truck and will not feel like a car. My Ranger has 27,700 miles on it now and hopefully I can go a lot more with it.

 

[TJC]

I've been considering this as I have the launch shudder. however all the talk about not being able to run over 90 is holding me back. the speed limit is 75-80mph most of where I drive on the highway and I occasionally run up over 90 for a min or two while overtaking an oil field truck. if it didn't have the critical speed so low as to cause a problem I'd already have one.

All that talk in this Forum about TW not meeting critical speed requirements is talk.

Dana / Spicer built the Ford Driveshaft. Dana/Spicer has a driveshaft calculator on their website.

I ran the numbers for both driveshafts through the calculator and the TW driveshaft was substantially superior in performance to the Ford driveshaft. You can see the results for yourself at my post in that thread.

I have had my TW driveshaft on my truck for quite a while now, and I have had it into those speeds you mentioned. It is smooth as silk in all speed ranges. My truck now drives as I expected it to when I purchased it.

 

[navsnipe]

I suspect that the slop in the driveshaft plays a role in the transmission failures we are starting to see as well.

My transmission has been behaving itself since the TW Driveshaft was installed.

It used to hang on too long coming to a stop, then disengage just as I stopped, jerking my head forward. Then when beginning to move forward at slow speeds, it would lug enough to pulse the torque on the entire drive train. Constant load is one thing, but a power load that abruptly pulses in rapid succession destroys components... and I think it originates from a sloppy loose 2 piece driveshaft that confuses the hell out of the transmission's adaptive firmware.

That's my theory.

I have to agree with your observation as my Ranger's transmission has been rather well behaved too since the I put the TW driveshaft on it.

 

[CO2Ranger]

I've read/heard that from a couple people. Which is exactly what I mean when I talk about quality>quantity of results. It makes it feel wrong to consider discontinuing these shafts and taking the "Not my problem, buddy" approach. For the time being at least, we will continue to offer them and we will continue to monitor how well this shaft performs.

Look on the bright side Shawn, they'll probably have the same shitty setup in the 6G!

Also, I love my TW one piece. Haven't been off-road with it yet, but on the street it's so much better. AND when that slip joint starts clunking I just pump it full of grease with the convenient fitting and I'm back in Smoothville ?

 

[Superspirit]

All that talk in this Forum about TW not meeting critical speed requirements is talk.

Dana / Spicer built the Ford Driveshaft. Dana/Spicer has a driveshaft calculator on their website.

I ran the numbers for both driveshafts through the calculator and the TW driveshaft was substantially superior in performance to the Ford driveshaft. You can see the results for yourself at my post in that thread.

I have had my TW driveshaft on my truck for quite a while now, and I have had it into those speeds you mentioned. It is smooth as silk in all speed ranges. My truck now drives as I expected it to when I purchased it.

I read that when you posted it. And I have no doubt your numbers are correct. But I remember Shawn from Tom woods stating that he didn't want his shafts spun that fast. If Shawn would come back and make the statement it's safe at that speed then I'd get one coming when income tax gets here in a week or two.

 

[TJC]

I read that when you posted it. And I have no doubt your numbers are correct. But I remember Shawn from Tom words stating that he didn't want his shafts spun that fast. If Shawn would come back and make the statement it's safe at that speed then I'd get one coming when income tax gets here in a week or two.

I think that he has already said that it was good to 100. And that if you felt the need to go that fast get something other then your truck (paraphrased).

If I were in his shoes I'd be telling you the same thing.

 

[CO2Ranger]

I read that when you posted it. And I have no doubt your numbers are correct. But I remember Shawn from Tom words stating that he didn't want his shafts spun that fast. If Shawn would come back and make the statement it's safe at that speed then I'd get one coming when income tax gets here in a week or two.

On stock (30.5in) tires the shaft would be spinning at 4522rpms at the speed limiter (110mph). You could do 95mph and still be under Shawn's conservative threshold (3905rpm).

I've taken it up to 105 on 33in tires and it wasn't the driveshaft I was worried about!

 

[MIBuckeye]

I'm happy to hear that the shaft worked well for you. You know something, your post came at a funny coincidental time. Just a few days ago I was talking to a colleague about how some new products are a hit and some are a dud but we just don't know for sure until we bring the product to market. I used these Ranger shafts as an example and was saying that we may soon pull the plug on this experiment. We're still going to wait a little while and see how well these perform for people on average but we've had a couple customers recently for whom the shaft did not fix their vibrations, bringing down the average success rate. Also, when we first developed these shafts it was after hearing from people and seeing forum threads which made me think that there was a significant problem with these trucks. I thought that the few people I talked to were just the tip of the iceberg. Now, after having the shaft available for some time, I am starting to think that the 20 or so people who I've seen/heard complain of drive shaft shudders might have just been a vocal minority, not the tip of any considerable iceberg. Either that or people still have a lot of hesitancy ordering a 1-piece replacement. The point being, we haven't sold as many as I thought and probably ordered way too much inventory of parts and had too many of the flange spacer/bushings made. This one might be a dud. From a business perspective that sucks, we certainly don't like to invest money and time into new products that just sit on the shelf. But then again there is no success without trying and with enough tries comes a few failures. But then I saw your post and how enthusiastic you are about the improvement that our drive shaft made in your Truck. From a non-economic perspective, of just helping people find a solution to a problem, this becomes a bit of a quality>quantity story for me. In which when it works it works very well and people are very happy with the results. This gives me hesitation about potentially pulling it from the market.

Now Shawn...maybe you could cobble together some of those extra parts you have and make a custom one for my Tremor? I'd certainly pay you a reasonable premium you might need to make it happen. Asking nicely..

 

[Shawn at Tom Wood's]

Yep, @TJC, you have paraphrased me well. I've put the tools out there for people to dig deeper into the "critical speed" thing, so that you don't have to take anyone's word for it, including my own. But while some evidence supports that theoretically go faster than 100 I'm not going to green light that one bit. I've maintained the position that if you want to drive faster than 100 you need to buy yourself a racecar, not a pickup truck, and then go to a track where it is safe and legal. The thing with speed and speed related problems is that it isn't like there's a magic number where everything under that speed is safe and fine while crossing that threshold ensures disaster. Rather, the faster you go the more potential there is for problems. It's almost an exponential curve. I don't know if I shared it yet but I created a graph of centrifugal force of mass and how it increases as speed increases. I used something like 1 ounce of weight at 3" swing diameter, but the exact data doesn't matter so much as the concept matters. centrifugal force, and therefor vibrations increase on a non-linear curve as speed increases. Another way framing this would be to say that speed related problems, or the likelihood thereof, increases on a near exponential curve. I want nothing to do with the problems potentially associated with spinning a steel drive shaft in a pickup truck as fasts as it spins at 100+ mph. That's the bottom line for me for critical speed and where I've set the limits. That there's a point at which I say "No thanks, I'm out". Here's the graph I referenced above. Which reminds me of a funny and very relevant video that I saw on youtube. It has bad words so I won't post it here but search "find out graph" on Youtube if you're inclined.

 

[Shawn at Tom Wood's]

Now Shawn...maybe you could cobble together some of those extra parts you have and make a custom one for my Tremor? I'd certainly pay you a reasonable premium you might need to make it happen. Asking nicely..

We've got to finish with this can of worms before we open another one.

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