EV's... Rolling Blackouts in 115 F. Heat

[D Fresh]

The 2008 Toyota Matrix in our garage is getting long in the tooth and with WFH, it's rarely driven therefore we have decided that the car that will replace it will be EV and that purchase will be made in 2023 as a new crop of EVs hit the market.
Give me a 300 mile range and a <15 minute charge to another 300 mile range and I'm ALL IN.

If you think whatever EV you buy in 2023 will charge 300 miles of range in 15 minutes you're smoking crack.

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[DeathRanger]

If you think whatever EV you buy in 2023 will charge 300 miles of range in 15 minutes you're smoking crack.

Directly from Tesla's Website. https://www.tesla.com/models
New Tesla Model S that is being driven on the roads right now.

405 mile range
200miles recharge in 15 minutes

 

[D Fresh]

Directly from Tesla's Website. https://www.tesla.com/models
New Tesla Model S that is being driven on the roads right now.

405 mile range
200miles recharge in 15 minutes

His post said one of "new crop of EVs" available in '23.

I assume that charge time is on a Supercharger. Far as I know you can only charge Teslas on Superchargers.

There won't be any EVs you can charge 300 miles worth in 15 minutes in your garage in 2023.

I assumed he meant charging at home because I don't see anybody driving to a parking lot to sit for that long just to fuel up. At least I wouldn't. That is not my idea of convenient.

And dude is replacing a Toyota Matrix, he's not buying a $100k car.

 

[ROBERTECOX]

At least the EV's won't have Auto Start Stop...Or will they?

 

[Sashimi_Moto]

If you think whatever EV you buy in 2023 will charge 300 miles of range in 15 minutes you're smoking crack.

I'm not expecting this in 2023 for the Matrix replacement. Those were 2 difference sentences as the Toyota Matrix is not my vehicle, the Ranger is. However, if Toyota's Solid State batteries work out - it could happen within the next 5 years.

We will replace the Matrix with the best EV that fits our needs at that time. I will not buy an EV for myself until it meets the 300 <15 minutes criteria which will exist when it's time to replace the Ranger (10-15 years). We have to have at least 1 vehicle that can drive over a snowy pass in winter and do a 1000 mile road trip with stints that match our bladders and refuel/recharge in a time that matches that of modern fuel pumps.

 

[D Fresh]

I'm not expecting this in 2023 for the Matrix replacement. Those were 2 difference sentences as the Toyota Matrix is not my vehicle, the Ranger is. However, if Toyota's Solid State batteries work out - it could happen within the next 5 years.

We will replace the Matrix with the best EV that fits our needs at that time. I will not buy an EV for myself until it meets the 300 <15 minutes criteria which will exist when it's time to replace the Ranger (10-15 years). We have to have at least 1 vehicle that can drive over a snowy pass in winter and do a 1000 mile road trip with stints that match our bladders and refuel/recharge in a time that matches that of modern fuel pumps.

That makes sense.

Personally I'm going to let the early adopters work out all the kinks for me before I jump in. I can totally understand where you're at.

 

[Langwilliams]

I'm not expecting this in 2023 for the Matrix replacement. Those were 2 difference sentences as the Toyota Matrix is not my vehicle, the Ranger is. However, if Toyota's Solid State batteries work out - it could happen within the next 5 years.

We will replace the Matrix with the best EV that fits our needs at that time. I will not buy an EV for myself until it meets the 300 <15 minutes criteria which will exist when it's time to replace the Ranger (10-15 years). We have to have at least 1 vehicle that can drive over a snowy pass in winter and do a 1000 mile road trip with stints that match our bladders and refuel/recharge in a time that matches that of modern fuel pumps.

I don't know what kind of weather you frequently have but you mentioned a snowy pass....cold reduces battery range. Severe cold kills it. We get the occasional artic blast an from what I've read it cut the range in half.

 

[Sashimi_Moto]

I don't know what kind of weather you frequently have but you mentioned a snowy pass....cold reduces battery range. Severe cold kills it. We get the occasional artic blast an from what I've read it cut the range in half.

The solid state batteries supposedly overcome this and operate within a reasonable percentage down to -40C depending on who's data you're reading.

Toyota was set to launch a solid state battery EV this year, but I think it may get pushed back.

 

[outdoorphotog]

Any sane person realizes EVs are never going to make sense

 

[Trigganometry]

It takes 500,000 gallons of water to mine one metric ton of lithium for car batteries. That is a LOT of water. That gives you almost exactly 2 electric cars.


While we’re on the subject of renewable resources

Something to think about.

 

[AzScorpion]

It takes 500,000 gallons of water to mine one metric ton of lithium for car batteries. That is a LOT of water. That gives you almost exactly 2 electric cars.


While we’re on the subject of renewable resources

Something to think about.

This will be interesting out here in the west where there's already a huge water shortage. So where will all this extra water come from? Sure they can be produced in other areas but it still doesn't mean that won't (will) put a huge strain on their water too?Desalination is expensive so that's not really an option yet.

 

[DeathRanger]

Can you cite any data please?

"Reportedly, 3,840 liters (1,104 gallons) of water are evaporated for the lithium of a battery that has a capacity of 64 kilowatt-hours of capacity. You may think that is a lot of water being evaporated, but according to Fichtner, this is the same amount of water production in 250 grams of beef, 10 avocados, 30 cups of coffee, or even a half of a pair of jeans."

https://cleantechnica.com/2020/01/05/lithium-production-less-pollution-than-from-11-avocados/

 

[FoD]

This will be interesting out here in the west where there's already a huge water shortage. So where will all this extra water come from? Sure they can be produced in other areas but it still doesn't mean that won't (will) put a huge strain on their water too?Desalination is expensive so that's not really an option yet.

No problem, living in CA the methodology has already been in practice for years, it's called "income redistribution" as you will pay higher prices for the restricted water YOU are allowed, while the state covers others costs via rebate and incentive for others

 

[AzScorpion]

Can you cite any data please?

"Reportedly, 3,840 liters (1,104 gallons) of water are evaporated for the lithium of a battery that has a capacity of 64 kilowatt-hours of capacity. You may think that is a lot of water being evaporated, but according to Fichtner, this is the same amount of water production in 250 grams of beef, 10 avocados, 30 cups of coffee, or even a half of a pair of jeans."

https://cleantechnica.com/2020/01/05/lithium-production-less-pollution-than-from-11-avocados/

A quick search shows this.

https://www.instituteforenergyresea...pump salty, mineral-rich brine to the surface.

Processing of Lithium Ore

The lithium extraction process uses a lot of water—approximately 500,000 gallons per metric ton of lithium. To extract lithium, miners drill a hole in salt flats and pump salty, mineral-rich brine to the surface. After several months the water evaporates, leaving a mixture of manganese, potassium, borax and lithium salts which is then filtered and placed into another evaporation pool. After between 12 and 18 months of this process, the mixture is filtered sufficiently that lithium carbonate can be extracted.

 

[DrewKD88]

I'm from the Los Angeles area. There are a lot of EV's out here especially Teslas. They are beautifully designed cars with some awesome tech. My neighbor has one that she charges nightly. However, I would never get one because I'm not a pretentious prick. I'm much more practical. I love my gasoline engines. I had a hybrid and my wife owns a hybrid. Those are practical. EV's......not so much. Both my wife and neighbor want Broncos. Why? Because they are badass and extremely useful. Let's face it, unless you're using an EV to commute under the perfect circumstances then all EV's do for you is boost your ego while pretending to be environmentally friendly. I get that some individuals just love the tech and design that goes into these things. That's cool and I don't fault them for having one. But to say that you have one because you're saving the environment is bunch of BS. Carbon emissions is not that big of a deal especially when compared to how the batteries are made. Let's call a spade a spade.

To the OP, it's all about mismanagement of the power grid. Same goes for water and every other resource. We produce so much oil domestically yet gas prices out here are topping $4.25 for 87. I just came back from a 9 state tour in the Northwestern part of the US. It was nice to see gas prices for under $3.

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