Upper Control Arm Options

[PNW_Ranger87]

Is that a peel able sticker on the side? I think those pockets would hold a lot of water/crap.

I'll comment. It's aluminum, no need to worry about premature corrosion IMO. If that was your worry. But judging by your distaste of the stickers I beat you're worried about the aesthetics.

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[jhndeergrn]

I'll comment. It's aluminum, no need to worry about premature corrosion IMO. If that was your worry. But judging by your distaste of the stickers I beat you're worried about the aesthetics.

Not forking up $1,300 for UCA’s that will hold road salt and shit I have to clean out every other week; yes, I’m after clean look. Thanks for your response.

 

[P. A. Schilke]

I'll comment. It's aluminum, no need to worry about premature corrosion IMO. If that was your worry. But judging by your distaste of the stickers I beat you're worried about the aesthetics.

Hi Erik,

Not really true on no worries....Chloride compounds, like salt attack the protective coating of Aluminum oxide that forms on the outside of an aluminum part, and thus results in terrible corrosion. For this upper control arm, I would watch it like a hawk for corrosion unless the manufacturer has coated it with a protective, and durable coating. Based on the thickness of this UCA, it should be a non issue for many miles of useful life, but it should not be ignored, but inspected for corrosion. I would be interested in the CAE modeling of this part to understand if it is really robust enough for the front suspension. Likely this part was never analyzed.... What load cases, what were the boundary conditions. Where were the SPC's applied etc. As always...Buyer be aware!

Best,
Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retierd

 

[PNW_Ranger87]

Well they certainly don't look bare. Plus, this is listed on their site: "Lifetime guarantee against ICON fabricated component breakage or manufacturer defect." They're very easily accessible with a power washer so unless you're not properly taking care of your vehicle basic cleanliness habits should keep them free of issues.

 

[P. A. Schilke]

Well they certainly don't look bare. Plus, this is listed on their site: "Lifetime guarantee against ICON fabricated component breakage or manufacturer defect." They're very easily accessible with a power washer so unless you're not properly taking care of your vehicle basic cleanliness habits should keep them free of issues.

Hi Erik,

Agree...and as this is a Mod, folks will likely pay way more attention than a casual customer...but if these UCA's were on a dealer bought unit by some well to do customer, all bets are off. The takeaway of this that Ford sells to more than the enthusiast market and they will not check or even know to check such... That is why TPMS and Change Oil Now indicators are part of the OEM Vehicle.

Best,
Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retired

 

[pgallagher2ii]

Hi Phil,

Pat Gallagher, here, I have be testing aircraft in Wichita, KS for over 25 years. I think that your under estimation of an after market parts supplier to test and/or analyze there design is not only naive but also some what condescending. I'm sure that names like ICON and BDS have stress engineers that have modeled and tested there designs quite thoroughly. Just my very educated opinion...

 

[P. A. Schilke]

Hi Phil,

Pat Gallagher, here, I have be testing aircraft in Wichita, KS for over 25 years. I think that your under estimation of an after market parts supplier to test and/or analyze there design is not only naive but also some what condescending. I'm sure that names like ICON and BDS have stress engineers that have modeled and tested there designs quite thoroughly. Just my very educated opinion...

Well Pat,

Then have them provide the engineering analysis...something that they have not done. Cutting the frame and adding thin brackets of TBD metallurgy and no analysis is simply putting the problem if it develops into the buyers hands.

I have supported the SEMA manufacturers at the Show in Las Vegas for many years and there are many great manufactures...And they share their engineering analysis. And where is their durability testing to assure that they meet the Ford Truck 150,000 mile durability requirement....

Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retired

 

[Frenchy]

I have to agree with Phil on this. If a company can not provide any engineering results then it isnt worth it. I do have a lift on my truck anf that is the Old Man EMU lift by ARB and the nice thing about it is I did not have to change the upper control arms either. I was able to get it into spec with the alignment and i can say that I am very pleased with the results. When I'm offroad I still have good control of the vehicle and on the street the ride has improved. Also to take into account ARB does a lot of testing before they release the product. They want to make sure you are getting a quality product that works well in a practical situation.

Now I am aware that Fors will not warranty the lift kit since it was not an option from Ford but I also have the confidence that I shouldnt run into any major problems that some other companies may give if I were to use a cheaper(lack of better term) kit.

If anything my thought is if you buy a kit and you still have to buy other parts to make it work and the manufacturer doesnt mention it then you probably need to consider something else to spend you money on.

 

[ParkerAzJeff]

Chris/Frenchy
While I appreciate your positive comments on your OME kit, I must ask if you're a paid spokesman for them? It seems as though if anyone is not using their kit you think they've made a bad choice.

 

[Frenchy]

I'll be straight and honest and say that no I'm not being paid by ARB or old man emu. The biggest thing I have noticed though is a lot of people have already posted that once they have a leveling kit installed whether it's the spacers or even the fox kit for some reason shops cannot seem to get the vehicles in spec for the alignment without getting upper control arms. Now I can't say for sure if that might be something with the shops that are installing them or if there's something wrong with the kit itself. I will also say that I'm not going to talk s*** about Fox since I do know they make some pretty good stuff. Also it seems like I'm the only one here that went with the full old man emu lift kit so I'm probably the Oddball around here.

 

[ParkerAzJeff]

With the help of this forum I spent a bunch of time researching what would be the best choice for my terrain and chose the Icon kit with UCA's. Your comments about OME had me considering it but I felt Icon was best for me. I'm glad that we have so many options to choose from & believe everyone should spend the time to find out what's best for them. I also agree with you about tire size's and the effects it has on the Ranger. Bigger isn't always better. The funny thing is we think the same way only with a little twist.

 

[Getnwithit]

I'll be straight and honest and say that no I'm not being paid by ARB or old man emu. The biggest thing I have noticed though is a lot of people have already posted that once they have a leveling kit installed whether it's the spacers or even the fox kit for some reason shops cannot seem to get the vehicles in spec for the alignment without getting upper control arms. Now I can't say for sure if that might be something with the shops that are installing them or if there's something wrong with the kit itself. I will also say that I'm not going to talk s*** about Fox since I do know they make some pretty good stuff. Also it seems like I'm the only one here that went with the full old man emu lift kit so I'm probably the Oddball around here.

I was looking into some of these "kits" and I think Falcon is the only manufacturer to mention that UCA's are required with their lift kits. I wasn't wanting to pay for the control arms but my installer said, there must be a reason Falcon mentions it. I did end up going with his advice, BDS UCA's, and doing it right the first time.

 

[pgallagher2ii]

Well Pat,

Then have them provide the engineering analysis...something that they have not done. Cutting the frame and adding thin brackets of TBD metallurgy and no analysis is simply putting the problem if it develops into the buyers hands.

I have supported the SEMA manufacturers at the Show in Las Vegas for many years and there are many great manufactures...And they share their engineering analysis. And where is their durability testing to assure that they meet the Ford Truck 150,000 mile durability requirement....

Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retired

Phil,

When has Ford ever supplied any stress analysis or durability data... and why would they. We have to supply limited data for certification to the FAA but most of our data is proprietary for our designs. The automotive industry is not even regulated as much as our aircraft industry so testing and metallurgy controls are pretty loose. Some of the materials used on the Icon UCA's are heavily regulated 6061 and 6063 aluminum's used in the aircraft industry.

Pat Gallagher
Structural Test Engineer

 

[P. A. Schilke]

Phil,

When has Ford ever supplied any stress analysis or durability data... and why would they. We have to supply limited data for certification to the FAA but most of our data is proprietary for our designs. The automotive industry is not even regulated as much as our aircraft industry so testing and metallurgy controls are pretty loose. Some of the materials used on the Icon UCA's are heavily regulated 6061 and 6063 aluminum's used in the aircraft industry.

Pat Gallagher
Structural Test Engineer

Hi Patrick

You are in a different environment. I have only modified a plane once in my lifetime...A Grumman Tiger with a caster front wheel that was stuck on my buddies plane. How many planes do you sell a year? 600,000? Ford will supply data to aftermarket with credible credentials...Take Roush, Livernois, and Fox for example as many purchasers are already to the point of modding their vehicle from the get go. Ford will even ally with manufactures of aftermarket parts to sell under the Ford Performance brand...but these parts are tested to Ford Standards before being offered on Ford vehicles... We do not provide stress analysis but we to supply loads data for vehicles as determined by the vehicle program manager or the Vehicle Engineering Manager. As that person I reviewed aftermarket companies wanting to offer up their designs...most did not cut the mustard so to speak but some had the resources and this data was provided. The company can then perform their analysis and design parts that use these loads. If we sold vehicles that were not modifiable...sales would suffer.

Go to SEMA and you will see so much junk. Lift kits using angle iron as I have seen. My sense on these forums is that ICON is a quality supplier but use of materials is only one factor, so 6061 or 6063 are good but where is their analysis capability? I have no experience with ICON. I do see with other parts manufacturers and see red flags. These should be avoided, but it is customer beware.

All I can say is that it is up to the customer to accept the risk. These forums will flush out most of the poorer offerings but not always.

Let me give you an example from the RV Market...Ford sells a chassis called the E450...an aftermarket company installs a body on the truck. They chose a chassis without a radio as they wished to install an aftermarket sound system. They select a POS head unit...the knob on the head unit falls off while the driver is trying to adjust the volume....What did he say as the steering wheel has the Ford Oval....This Ford is a POS. Not our radio and not our problem but the implications it is Ford's fault. Thus we had to create a program called QVM...Qualified Vehicle Modifer. To get a Ford chassis they had to comply with our stringent requirements. No sitck built house wiring nuts on wiring for example.

ICON and other manufacturers can apply to Ford, but not many make it. Most to not even try as it is likely they will not make it.

Condescendingly,
Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retired

 

[pgallagher2ii]

Hi Patrick

You are in a different environment. I have only modified a plane once in my lifetime...A Grumman Tiger with a caster front wheel that was stuck on my buddies plane. How many planes do you sell a year? 600,000? Ford will supply data to aftermarket with credible credentials...Take Roush, Livernois, and Fox for example as many purchasers are already to the point of modding their vehicle from the get go. Ford will even ally with manufactures of aftermarket parts to sell under the Ford Performance brand...but these parts are tested to Ford Standards before being offered on Ford vehicles... We do not provide stress analysis but we to supply loads data for vehicles as determined by the vehicle program manager or the Vehicle Engineering Manager. As that person I reviewed aftermarket companies wanting to offer up their designs...most did not cut the mustard so to speak but some had the resources and this data was provided. The company can then perform their analysis and design parts that use these loads. If we sold vehicles that were not modifiable...sales would suffer.

Go to SEMA and you will see so much junk. Lift kits using angle iron as I have seen. My sense on these forums is that ICON is a quality supplier but use of materials is only one factor, so 6061 or 6063 are good but where is their analysis capability? I have no experience with ICON. I do see with other parts manufacturers and see red flags. These should be avoided, but it is customer beware.

All I can say is that it is up to the customer to accept the risk. These forums will flush out most of the poorer offerings but not always.

Let me give you an example from the RV Market...Ford sells a chassis called the E450...an aftermarket company installs a body on the truck. They chose a chassis without a radio as they wished to install an aftermarket sound system. They select a POS head unit...the knob on the head unit falls off while the driver is trying to adjust the volume....What did he say as the steering wheel has the Ford Oval....This Ford is a POS. Not our radio and not our problem but the implications it is Ford's fault. Thus we had to create a program called QVM...Qualified Vehicle Modifer. To get a Ford chassis they had to comply with our stringent requirements. No sitck built house wiring nuts on wiring for example.

ICON and other manufacturers can apply to Ford, but not many make it. Most to not even try as it is likely they will not make it.

Condescendingly,
Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retired

that's right, I forgot, Vehicle manufactures don't sell stuff that fails or is poorly engineered..... Sorry my bad.....

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