Tremor with TSB 20-2277 - Shutter on Acceleration

[MIBuckeye]

I'm having the same problems. 2021 Ranger Tremor Lariat 4x4 and it shakes and shutters from a stop, shakes and shudders from 25 to 35 mph, and then continues on at basically all speeds above that. It's the worst when starting to accelerate from a stop and in that 25-35 mph bracket, though. The vibration and the shaking drives me insane and it's all I can think about when driving the truck. It is present at all speeds.

It's at the dealership again and they're trying to investigate the source of the problem, so we'll see what comes of it. They're being very helpful and have escalated the problem back to Ford engineering, which I'm thankful for.

Chris - have you had any luck with yours in the last couple weeks?

Yep...I feel like you and I are in the same exact place. Mine is at the dealer now also and they are replacing the driveshaft and performing some other things...they said they were going to take a few days to do what they need to...so Im assuming it is more than simply replacing the driveshaft, because that would take literally 5 minutes on the hoist. It is really strange that something is really a miss and it is obvious when driving it. It is MUCH more than the start up shutter too, as you say. It really feels like im driving an old truck with oversized unmatched tires.....Ive seen some problems with the wheels (not sure where I saw it though) that I want them to look into...they rebalanced, but not sure they road-forced them which I will have them do .... I have owned and driven and diagnosed lots of cars in my lifetime and this just screams of a wheel problem to me. I did get a pretty nifty app for my phone that does vibration analysis and it is pointing to a 2nd order vibration at 35-50 and again at 70-85....says this is most likely a wheel/tire/bearing/front shaft problem...

Chris

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[aimsomewhere]

Hey Chris,

Thanks for the reply. I've no insight on what tests they're going to be performing yet, so hopefully, I'll get more information soon. They've balanced all the tires inspected the wheels multiple times without any changes, so I think it's a larger issue that needs to be addressed.

I asked for a road force alignment and a vibration test, but they're waiting for Ford to confirm the best path to proceed before taking additional action. I suspect I will have some more information sometime tomorrow.

Were they able to get the driveshaft replacement or is that still backordered?

Thanks again man!

 

[MIBuckeye]

Wrong driveshaft. Numbers are not correct im told. Now they want to give it back to me until they get direction from Ford. Um....no.

 

[MIBuckeye]

...and now the driveshaft is on backorder...and my Tremor sits at the dealer 10+ days and counting...

 

[aimsomewhere]

HI Chris,

I am not familiar with what is "out there" today, but there are phone apps that can determine frequency. Just the basics.... Engine RPM can be expressed in frequency. Divide RPM by 60...so idle at 600 rpm is also 10 HZ. Now if a four cylinder, firing frequency is twice a revolution or at idle of 600prm is 20HZ...Okay still with me... On a V6 firing frequency is 3rd order. V8...4th order. So if you determine your vibration is above the engine rpm at 40 mph for example, but it is a multiple of 1st order...you have an engine excitation problem...now down the drive line which has to factor in the transmission gearing to determine driveline rpm. If the problem matches driveline vibration, then you know where to focus. For example....the offending vibration is at 40mph and the 10th gear ratio is 0.5. or half engine rpm and lets say your tach reads 1200 rpm or 20HZ, your vibration is at 10 Hz or half ... look at the driveline. Now go through the rear axle at 3.73, if the vibration around 2.6Hz...then you have a wheel tire problem.

Make sense?

Best,
Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retired

Hey Phil!

I had a couple of questions about the vibration testing you're talking about here, but I wasn't able to send you a private message. That could very well be user error on my part, but I figured I'd ping you here and see if sending you a note directly was an option. I'd love your opinion about something

Cheers,

-Eric

 

[P. A. Schilke]

Hey Phil!

I had a couple of questions about the vibration testing you're talking about here, but I wasn't able to send you a private message. That could very well be user error on my part, but I figured I'd ping you here and see if sending you a note directly was an option. I'd love your opinion about something

Cheers,

-Eric

Hi Eric,

My PM box got overloaded early on and the moderators and I determined I needed to turn off PMs Reason is that many folks can read and may benefit from a forum member question instead of keeping this private. Hopefully it makes sense to you... So ask away. If you wish to get to me due to the sensitive nature, send the inquiry to a moderator and they can get to me via PM.

Best,
Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retired

 

[awd.nv]

I think I noticed what is being mentioned here. I was towing and think it was second gear, rolled into it a bit to grab speed before a hill and felt like a shake in the drivetrain? Not sure if axle wrap or what? I am just gonna monitor it and watch out for bulletins/recalls. Only did it when I was trying to give it the beans from a stop so not too worried at this moment.

Not sure yet if I felt it without towing, I was a bit easy on it the first 1000 miles. Now that I passed that I am being a little more heavy on the throttle at times but can't recall it actually happening outside of towing.

 

[MIBuckeye]

I'm thinking about simply removing the rear drive shaft and driving it in 4H to see if the shutter and my vibration goes away. Seems like the lowest cost isolation diagnostic test I can do. Does anyone see any issues with this? If it goes away I may bring the drive shaft to a local driveline shop and see what they find. It looks like my replacement shaft is no where in sight so might as well mess with it in the interim.

 

[MIBuckeye]

Ok....well it AINT the rear driveshaft!!! Its not even in the truck and the shaking is just as bad, if not worse now. WTF.

 

[JTDay]

Very annoying that must be! I'm having the same issues you and aimsomewhere have mentioned. Basically vibration at all speeds, start up vibration, and some odd transmission behavior/lumpy idle. My first call to dealer was May 13 and I'm STILL waiting on my truck to get looked at. I showed up on Monday and was pretty calm but told them "I need this issue resolved". So, you're not the only one. Hopefully a solution will be realized with our collective efforts and demands from Ford.

 

[MIBuckeye]

Very annoying that must be! I'm having the same issues you and aimsomewhere have mentioned. Basically vibration at all speeds, start up vibration, and some odd transmission behavior/lumpy idle. My first call to dealer was May 13 and I'm STILL waiting on my truck to get looked at. I showed up on Monday and was pretty calm but told them "I need this issue resolved". So, you're not the only one. Hopefully a solution will be realized with our collective efforts and demands from Ford.

Sux to hear of more people.... is yours a Tremor?

 

[JTDay]

Sux to hear of more people.... is yours a Tremor?

2021 4x4 with locking diff.

 

[quangdog]

Ok....well it AINT the rear driveshaft!!! Its not even in the truck and the shaking is just as bad, if not worse now. WTF.

So let me make sure I understand (cause I'm super interested in getting rid of the start-up shudder, but my local dealer is horribly incompetent): You completely removed the rear driveshaft (from the center carrier bearing back to the rear diff), put the truck into 4WD, and drove around a bit... and the start-up shudder is *still there*??

 

[P. A. Schilke]

Hi Folks,

Okay....again...you need to determine the frequencies of these vibrations relative to engine rpm and vehicle speed. This info can determine orders which can direct you to the source of the vibration. Then dealers have NVH equipment to accomplish this and it is very helpful to determine root cause. Otherwise you become a part swapper hoping you swap the right part and things work out. At Ford we could not take a chance on diagnostics like this as the vehicle population from which we had to deal was huge. We had to understand root cause. So much vibration attributed to the driveshaft is likely 2nd order wheel/tire. First order is tire balance. Second order is tire ovality, off center wheel studs, poorly machined wheels and so on. So shimming the driveshaft is ineffective because this is not the fix. There is a lot of data contained in NVH measurements and the instrumentation is sophisticated enough to lead to a robust fix. I know this sounds crazy but it works... I had very sophisticated FFT analyzers at my disposal but it was not the data generated but the information contained in the data. Now the dealership Analyzers can tell you that the order is 3.73 times the wheel rotation... Radar locked in on the driveshaft. Vibration is first order wheel. Balance, and so it goes.

Folks here see the word vibration and go that is my problem also...likely not the case. Diagnostic data and extraction of the information contained in the data is extremely helpful.

Best,
Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retired

 

[MIBuckeye]

So let me make sure I understand (cause I'm super interested in getting rid of the start-up shudder, but my local dealer is horribly incompetent): You completely removed the rear driveshaft (from the center carrier bearing back to the rear diff), put the truck into 4WD, and drove around a bit... and the start-up shudder is *still there*??

Yup. As well as my vibration at 35-45 and my vibration at 70-85. All still there.

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