Headlight brightness

[D Fresh]

You are correct.
I was taking the numbers from post #31. I plotted it out based on what was posted there.

Headlights at 54" adjusted to be down 5" at 25' would hit the ground at 112.5'
Headlights at 54" adjusted to be at 42" at 75' would hit the ground at 337.5'

And as you stated, that doesn't apply to passenger vehicles.
Bottom line is to check with your state regulations.
I remember a time when headlight aim was part of the annual state safety inspection. Now here in Louisiana all they check is if lights, horn and wipers work.

And half the states don't even do one.

Doing the math you can see why Ford suggests putting the cutoff level with headlight height at 25' out.

It will light the legal distance, in my state at least, and also remain low enough as to not blind others.

There's a reason we used to say "you need to LEVEL your headlights." Somehow that vernacular changed to "align" or "adjust."

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[docarter]

It can't be higher than 5 inches below the center of the light projecting it.

I see, I may have misread but it still states in no case should it exceed 42", so it wouldn't have any impact on the max allowable height a Ranger could be aimed at.

 

[JACKSMYDOG]

I see, I may have misread but it still states in no case should it exceed 42", so it wouldn't have any impact on the max allowable height a Ranger could be aimed at.

The first part is they cannot be above 5 inches below the mounting height at 25 feet. That translates to ~2% (1 inch/60 inches) down angle is the highest adjustment allowed.

The second part is "and in no case higher than forty-two inches", both requirements must be met, not just the second.

(1) The headlamps shall be so aimed that when the vehicle is not loaded none of the high-intensity portion of the light shall at a distance of twenty-five feet ahead project higher than a level of five inches below the level of the center of the lamp from which it comes, and in no case higher than forty-two inches above the level on which the vehicle stands at a distance of seventy-five feet ahead.

 

[Jason B]

I looked it up for Louisiana. It doesn't give specific heights or guides for aiming of headlights

• Headlamps - Maximum Overall Height: 5' 4" Minimum Height: 24"
• 
  
• (1) There shall be an uppermost distribution of light, or composite beam, so aimed and of such intensity as to reveal persons and vehicles at a distance of at least 500 feet ahead for all conditions of loading.
  
  (2) There shall be a lowermost distribution of light, or composite beam, so aimed and of such intensity to reveal persons and vehicles at a distance of at least 150 feet ahead; and on a straight level road under any condition of loading none of the high intensity portion of the beam shall be directed to strike the eye of an approaching driver.
  
  And with fog lamps:
• 
  
• B. Any motor vehicle may be equipped with not more than two fog lamps mounted on the front of the vehicle at a height of not less than 12 inches nor more than 30 inches above the level surface upon which the vehicle stands and so aimed that when the vehicle is not loaded none of the high intensity portion of the light to the left of the center of the vehicle shall at a distance of 25 feet ahead project higher than a level of 4 inches below the level of the center of the lamp from which it comes. Lighted fog lamps meeting the above requirements may be used with lower head lamp beams as specified in R.S. 32:321.

 

[D Fresh]

I see, I may have misread but it still states in no case should it exceed 42", so it wouldn't have any impact on the max allowable height a Ranger could be aimed at.

DOT Title 49 does not apply to passenger vehicles

 

[docarter]

DOT Title 49 does not apply to passenger vehicles

Hey buddy, DOT (Department of Transportation) is a federal agency and not a statute. The statute I cited was the FMVSS (Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards Sec. 108). In the statute it says: " S3. Application. This standard applies to: (a) Passenger cars, multipurpose passenger vehicles, trucks, buses, trailers (except pole trailers and trailer converter dollies), and motorcycles . . ."

 

[D Fresh]

Hey buddy, DOT (Department of Transportation) is a federal agency and not a statute. The statute I cited was the FMVSS (Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards Sec. 108). In the statute it says: " S3. Application. This standard applies to: (a) Passenger cars, multipurpose passenger vehicles, trucks, buses, trailers (except pole trailers and trailer converter dollies), and motorcycles . . ."

Hey buddy.


The DOT is a regulatory agency tasked with enforcement.

FMVSS are codified in TITLE 49 of the Code of Federal Regulations.

The only agency which enforces said codes is the DOT. Hence the reason title 49 is generally referred to as DOT title 49.

And the entirety of title 49 is only applicable to commercial vehicles.

The section you are cherrypicking is stating that the standard, 108, is applicable to all passenger cars, multipurpose passenger vehicles, trucks, buses, trailers (except pole trailers and trailer converter dollies), and motorcycles which are used to transport property or passengers in interstate commerce.

The entirety of title 49, of which the FMVSS you are quoting is part of, is only applicable to to all employers, employees, and commercial motor vehicles that transport property or passengers in interstate commerce.

I work for a company which deals with CDOT and DOT regulations on the regular. I'm sorry if my use of the term "passenger vehicle" confused you.

Your truck is currently a passenger vehicle. If it were used for interstate commerce it would technically be a DOT regulated passenger vehicle and be required to comply with title 49 and all of the FMVSS.

But unless you're ferrying passengers or cargo out of state for money, it's ALL completely irrelevant to you.

 

[D Fresh]

Your truck is currently a passenger vehicle. If it were used for interstate commerce it would technically be a DOT regulated passenger vehicle and be required to comply with title 49 and all of the FMVSS.

But unless you're ferrying passengers or cargo out of state for money, it's ALL completely irrelevant to you.

Actually, thinking about it again. Your Ranger, given it's weight and passenger capacity would only fall under DOT regulation if you were transporting hazardous materials in large amounts accross state lines for money.

CFR 390.5

 

[Big Blue]

And the same quote without 3 dots replacing a very important factor.

(1) The headlamps shall be so aimed that when the vehicle is not loaded none of the high-intensity portion of the light shall at a distance of twenty-five feet ahead project higher than a level of five inches below the level of the center of the lamp from which it comes, and in no case higher than forty-two inches above the level on which the vehicle stands at a distance of seventy-five feet ahead.

I too would like to know where these numbers are coming, but I do agree it appears to be the lesser of the two numbers. What reg, section or page number. I looked through both linked regs and did not find any such numbers. I may have missed them though with all the legalese.

Again. Absolutely incorrect.

Where are you getting this imaginary 42" number? DOT title 49 DOES NOT apply to passenger cars.

Do the math. A headlight which sits at 54", legal in at least two states, pointed at 42" would hit the ground at less than 125ft. Nowhere near far enough to be effective, or legal in my state.

What is the legal distance in you state for distance on LOW beam. Are you sure the ~300 foot number I believe was quoted is not for HIGH beam. I believe the intent is that your low beams are always to be aimed down. Such that a vehicle with headlights lower than 42" can not have them aimed up. I have seen numbers listed from the FMVSS saying that low beams should project about 160 feet.

On another subject that was only recently brought up in passing. The brightness of lights being used. There have been a lot of people putting ridiculously bright LED bulbs into the low beam reflector assemblies. You @D Fresh have been one of the most vocal about this. If you put 16000 lumen/pair bulbs in the low beam reflectors it doesn't make any difference how well the are aimed you are going to blind someone.

 

[JACKSMYDOG]

I too would like to know where these numbers are coming, but I do agree it appears to be the lesser of the two numbers. What reg, section or page number. I looked through both linked regs and did not find any such numbers. I may have missed them though with all the legalese.



What is the legal distance in you state for distance on LOW beam. Are you sure the ~300 foot number I believe was quoted is not for HIGH beam. I believe the intent is that your low beams are always to be aimed down. Such that a vehicle with headlights lower than 42" can not have them aimed up. I have seen numbers listed from the FMVSS saying that low beams should project about 160 feet.

On another subject that was only recently brought up in passing. The brightness of lights being used. There have been a lot of people putting ridiculously bright LED bulbs into the low beam reflector assemblies. You @D Fresh have been one of the most vocal about this. If you put 16000 lumen/pair bulbs in the low beam reflectors it doesn't make any difference how well the are aimed you are going to blind someone.

When referencing aim, the angle being a negative but close to level is what's most important. Given that they are aimed properly, factory lights will have adequate power and focus to meet standards within the country they were destined for original sale.

 

[docarter]

But unless you're ferrying passengers or cargo out of state for money, it's ALL completely irrelevant to you.

The Federal Government has authority to regulate lots of intrastate activity and all interstate activity. It may regulate intrastate activity not involving "ferrying passengers or cargo out of state for money" where the cumulative effect of the intrastate activity could have a direct or indirect effect on interstate commerce. Likewise, even if regulating one person's vehicle isn't sufficient to constitute interstate activity if the aggregate affects of regulating all similarly situated individuals then affects interstate commerce then there is authority.

You can read more about this in the jurisprudence on the Commerce Clause. Also known as the "active commerce power."

In this instance the Federal Government is within its authority to regulate the design and configuration of automotive headlights. Not hard to justify the connection to interstate commerce there?

 

[JACKSMYDOG]

No worries

Ya, those are not my words in the quote.

 

[docarter]

Ya, those are not my words in the quote.

Sorry man, I don't know if the forum messed up I just clicked quote on the post ?

 

[docarter]

Actually, thinking about it again. Your Ranger, given it's weight and passenger capacity would only fall under DOT regulation if you were transporting hazardous materials in large amounts accross state lines for money.

CFR 390.5

That section is in the context of the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Regulations. Totally different than the section I quoted, which is the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration. The former is more specific to certain commercial vehicles but the latter organization determines basically every Federal rule pertaining to the safety equipment of passenger vehicles sold in the US.

You can see how the various organizations and rules are laid out here: https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-49/subtitle-B

 

[D Fresh]

I too would like to know where these numbers are coming, but I do agree it appears to be the lesser of the two numbers. What reg, section or page number. I looked through both linked regs and did not find any such numbers. I may have missed them though with all the legalese.



What is the legal distance in you state for distance on LOW beam. Are you sure the ~300 foot number I believe was quoted is not for HIGH beam. I believe the intent is that your low beams are always to be aimed down. Such that a vehicle with headlights lower than 42" can not have them aimed up. I have seen numbers listed from the FMVSS saying that low beams should project about 160 feet.

On another subject that was only recently brought up in passing. The brightness of lights being used. There have been a lot of people putting ridiculously bright LED bulbs into the low beam reflector assemblies. You @D Fresh have been one of the most vocal about this. If you put 16000 lumen/pair bulbs in the low beam reflectors it doesn't make any difference how well the are aimed you are going to blind someone.

Colorado states "sufficient to light a person or car @ 350 ft." That's roughly the length of a football field and end zones. Seems pretty reasonable.

Also, as I stated FMVSS are a part of title 49. Which is not applicable to non CMVs.

Absolutely agree with you regarding power and beam alignment.

The Federal Government has authority to regulate lots of intrastate activity and all interstate activity. It may regulate intrastate activity not involving "ferrying passengers or cargo out of state for money" where the cumulative effect of the intrastate activity could have a direct or indirect effect on interstate commerce. Likewise, even if regulating one person's vehicle isn't sufficient to constitute interstate activity if the aggregate affects of regulating all similarly situated individuals then affects interstate commerce then there is authority.

You can read more about this in the jurisprudence on the Commerce Clause. Also known as the "active commerce power."

In this instance the Federal Government is within its authority to regulate the design and configuration of automotive headlights. Not hard to justify the connection to interstate commerce there?

That section is in the context of the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Regulations. Totally different than the section I quoted, which is the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration. The former is more specific to certain commercial vehicles but the latter organization determines basically every Federal rule pertaining to the safety equipment of passenger vehicles sold in the US.

You can see how the various organizations and rules are laid out here: https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-49/subtitle-B

Your understanding of the law is severely flawed.

I've never seen such arrogance of ignorance.

You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink.

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