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[woodworker]

As someone who has worked in the industry, I'd be interested in your views on whether nuclear power is actually cost effective in the totality. ie not just how cheap the power is when a station is running well, but if you look at the total cost to build, run, waste disposal, and decommissioning and clean up, are they actually cost effective in the long term? Or do they ultimately use more energy than they produce.

Well, again my opinion, the stations I worked at here in Virginia were built and put on line on 72 and 73 for SPS anyway. From what I remember, they were built for like $450 million dollars. So yes, they are pretty much cash cows compared to what they would cost to build today. They have had two life extensions as I remember and are going through major renovations in the next few years to upgrade steam generators, turbines, and other major equipment.
So, older stations like this, yes, they are well worth the while to operate and maintain. As far as the newer stations, I’m not sure but I assume they will eventually pay for themselves in a few lifetimes. I was following the SMR development for awhile but most likely will not happen in my lifetime.
Hope this answers you questions.

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[woodworker]

Well, again my opinion, the stations I worked at here in Virginia were built and put on line on 72 and 73 for SPS anyway. From what I remember, they were built for like $450 million dollars. So yes, they are pretty much cash cows compared to what they would cost to build today. They have had two life extensions as I remember and are going through major renovations in the next few years to upgrade steam generators, turbines, and other major equipment.
So, older stations like this, yes, they are well worth the while to operate and maintain. As far as the newer stations, I’m not sure but I assume they will eventually pay for themselves in a few lifetimes. I was following the SMR development for awhile but most likely will not happen in my lifetime.
Hope this answers you questions.

SPS was one of the first to implement dry cask storage so there is that issue since the Yucca Mountain scam of the century. Those people wanted the millions for development of that storage knowing full well they would never let fuel be stored there and nobody will tell me any different.

 

[woodworker]

It's interesting too how things change with time, there is a very large dam not far from us, when it was built back in the late 1970's someone with a bit of foresight noted that the local topography was ideal for an associated pumped hydro plant. So a secondary dam was raised near the top of the mountains which contain the main dam and it was built at the same time although commissioned a couple of years later. The idea back then was that excess off peak (coal generated) power would be used to pump the water up to be released during peak demand. Which back then, meant basically night rate when the stations had to run at a certain level regardless of demand. They still use it, but now it primarily pumps up water during the day during excess rooftop solar production. That power is then used in the evening when solar production drops off.

Bath County

 

[pismo1]

No solar for me here in SOCal.No more net metering,25 year old roof,elec.bill in the mid 100s,no pool and no electric car.Wasnt worth doing.The variables would have to change for me to do it.Most do it and don't think about the older roof part.

 

[Chris M]

Bath County

Ah...Bath county....(re-directing the thread a little)...my daddy and I used to grouse hunt there when I was young, and daddy would go up there and hunt with some friends and co-workers from the barber shop he worked at. There was a cabin there (Jesse's 3 Cubs, it was named) and they used to all stay there to hunt. I went a couple of times but mainly just to be with daddy. I stayed out of the way of the men mostly.
Beautiful country. Makes me homesick a little.

 

[dtech]

Yep, had plenty of go arounds with we sting who use….

"You can be sure if it's Westinghouse" Sure to provoke 2nd thoughts about investing in nuclear.

 

[woodworker]

"You can be sure if it's Westinghouse" Sure to provoke 2nd thoughts about investing in nuclear.

Agree

 

[woodworker]

Ah...Bath county....(re-directing the thread a little)...my daddy and I used to grouse hunt there when I was young, and daddy would go up there and hunt with some friends and co-workers from the barber shop he worked at. There was a cabin there (Jesse's 3 Cubs, it was named) and they used to all stay there to hunt. I went a couple of times but mainly just to be with daddy. I stayed out of the way of the men mostly.
Beautiful country. Makes me homesick a little.

Those are precious moments you can never get back. Lost my dad several years back to cancer.

 

[woodworker]

No solar for me here in SOCal.No more net metering,25 year old roof,elec.bill in the mid 100s,no pool and no electric car.Wasnt worth doing.The variables would have to change for me to do it.Most do it and don't think about the older roof part.

Going on 72, it would never pay off now.

 

[pismo1]

Going on 72, it would never pay off now.

Another reason I had to consider.When did payoff in my 80s.

 

[AzScorpion]

Another reason I had to consider.When did payoff in my 80s.

One thing you have to take into account when figuring your ROI is the electric companies rate increases. I bought my solar back in 2015 and based on the initial rates I figured on a 10 year payback. When I sold my house 9 year later our electric went up 4 times (doesn't affect solar rates) which brought my ROI down from 10 years to about 6. If you're going to stay in your house and they have net metering it's well worth it because one way or another you're going to pay for it. Either pay for it up front or keep paying the electric company.

That's why I think they did away with the net metering because they were supposedly losing money. But they weren't because they took all your unused electricity and stored and used it to feed others when you banked it with them.

 

[woodworker]

One thing you have to take into account when figuring your ROI is the electric companies rate increases. I bought my solar back in 2015 and based on the initial rates I figured on a 10 year payback. When I sold my house 9 year later our electric went up 4 times (doesn't affect solar rates) which brought my ROI down from 10 years to about 6. If you're going to stay in your house and they have net metering it's well worth it because one way or another you're going to pay for it. Either pay for it up front or keep paying the electric company.

That's why I think they did away with the net metering because they were supposedly losing money. But they weren't because they took all your unused electricity and stored and used it to feed others when you banked it with them.

A few years ago when I had my new roof put on, that ROI would have sounded pretty good but I’m not sure I would get it back now. Plus my house had a funky roof with seven gable ends and a 12/12 pitch so not sure that would work anyway.

 

[dtech]

You can still buy solar shingles - at one time hyped as the next biggest thing - but I think that hasn't proved out. In the devlopment I live in all houses are required to have tile roofs and most if not all are concrete tiles and they are heavy, supposedly more difficult to install solar panels. Expensive roof but supposed to last 50+ yrs.

 

[AzScorpion]

A few years ago when I had my new roof put on, that ROI would have sounded pretty good but I’m not sure I would get it back now. Plus my house had a funky roof with seven gable ends and a 12/12 pitch so not sure that would work anyway.

If you have the room you're better off building the solar array on the ground. The last place I wanted mine was on the roof but sadly many like myself are stuck without enough ground space to set one up.

 

[woodworker]

If you have the room you're better off building the solar array on the ground. The last place I wanted mine was on the roof but sadly many like myself are stuck without enough ground space to set one up.

No ground space

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