Ford Halts Production of the F-150 Lightning EV. That’s a Plus for Rivian.

[AzScorpion]

Do hybrid batteries have the same heat problems? I know they cool them, but I thought that was due to density and high amperage issues. Do the batteries cool themselves even when the car is off. The only reason that I am asking is that Prius batteries were going for $2500 a while back.

My daughter has a Maverick. I can't get over the clicks, clunks, and other assorted noises emanating from it when it is on electric assist.

She is getting low to mid 40mpg with it.

I think that they were worth $20K, but I am not so sure at $25K, The interior seems very cheaply made. Seats thin, Dash hard plastic. It reminds me of the first new Chevette I ever laid eyes on at a showroom floor. it had an aluminum foil overlay around the gauge cluster.... and it came new from the factory with a wrinkle running across the cluster at a diagonal. Looked like aluminum foil sloppily glued down. If you look closely at the cluster picture below you can see it raised up in several places.

IDK I haven't looked into that much seeing as there's nothing I really care for yet. If they do the heat here would kill them, it can be well over 120* in my garage throughout the summer months.

I think most things are going cheap plastic now. I know many were complaining about how cheap the dash was on their Broncos. Even a couple of the testers of the new Chevy Colorado were saying the low-mid models were very cheap hard plastic feeling. It's sad that we'e now paying a fortune for these vehicles and the materials and quality have gone way down. It doesn't justify the cost buying a top model at all anymore.

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[dtech]

Do hybrid batteries have the same heat problems? I know they cool them, but I thought that was due to density and high amperage issues. Do the batteries cool themselves even when the car is off. The only reason that I am asking is that Prius batteries were going for $2500 a while back.

My daughter has a Maverick. I can't get over the clicks, clunks, and other assorted noises emanating from it when it is on electric assist.

She is getting low to mid 40mpg with it.

I think that they were worth $20K, but I am not so sure at $25K, The interior seems very cheaply made. Seats thin, Dash hard plastic. It reminds me of the first new Chevette I ever laid eyes on at a showroom floor. it had an aluminum foil overlay around the gauge cluster.... and it came new from the factory with a wrinkle running across the cluster at a diagonal. Looked like aluminum foil sloppily glued down. If you look closely at the cluster picture below you can see it raised up in several places.

There was some discussion regards the merits of the Chevy Chevette in a past thread, article below says it was the best selling small car - so you get what you pay for -

https://www.autoweek.com/car-life/c...0-chevrolet-chevette-hatchback-sedan/#:~:text

 

[dtech]

IDK I haven't looked into that much seeing as there's nothing I really care for yet. If they do the heat here would kill them, it can be well over 120* in my garage throughout the summer months.

Wouldn't a 120* garage be considered a "cool" place to hang out summertime in the Phoenix area .

 

[txquailguy]

My local Ford dealer in Ft. Collins has 2 Lightnings on the lot.....priced at a ridiculous $88K

I guess Ford is figuring out that folks don't really want to spend 90K on a very limited vehicle with only a 300 mile range.....probably half that if you are towing something.

Now that we know these battery packs last about 5 years and they are WAY EXPENSIVE to change out I would think the average consumer thinks of these vehicles as a maintenance liability in the long haul....

I can honestly say I would never buy an all-electric vehicle....MAYBE a hybrid.

I'm pretty blown away how many folks believe the lie that these e-vehicles are somehow green or good for the environment.....

 

[dtech]

.

Now that we know these battery packs last about 5 years and they are WAY EXPENSIVE to change out I would think they average consumer thinks of these vehicles as a maintenance liability in the long haul....

.

Even more reason to consider buying an EV - if the battery pack lasts just 5 yrs - the US gov mandates an 8 yr /100k warranty , Cali even longer. Not sure where you get the 5 yr longevity period but I don't believe it's accurate, Prius are a good example. But might see shorter lifespans from that recently announced FoMoCo joint venture. Hyundai it's life of vehicle.

How long do EV battery packs last?

Consumer Reports estimates the average EV battery pack's lifespan to be at around 200,000 miles, which is nearly 17 years of use if driven 12,000 miles per year.

https://www.jdpower.com/cars/shopping-guides/how-long-do-electric-car-batteries-last

 

[txquailguy]

Even more reason to consider buying an EV - if the battery pack lasts just 5 yrs - the US gov mandates an 8 yr /100k warranty , Cali even longer. Not sure where you get the 5 yr longevity period but I don't believe it's accurate, Prius are a good example. But might see shorter lifespans from that recently announced FoMoCo joint venture. Hyundai it's life of vehicle.

How long do EV battery packs last?

Consumer Reports estimates the average EV battery pack's lifespan to be at around 200,000 miles, which is nearly 17 years of use if driven 12,000 miles per year.

https://www.jdpower.com/cars/shopping-guides/how-long-do-electric-car-batteries-last

So you are ready to pony up $88K for a Lightning?

I need to find the article I read about Tesla battery packs dying too soon......

Also, you did not address the range issue......

Another thing to consider......have you seen the data on how much charging/power capacity is lost in below freezing weather?.......The Ford e-Mach is rated worst with a 30% loss in range in below freezing temperatures......

EV vehicles are limited at best........IMO

 

[dtech]

So you are ready to pony up $88K for a Lightning?

I need to find the article I read about Tesla battery packs dying too soon......

Also, you did not address the range issue......

Another thing to consider......have you seen the data on how much charging/power capacity is lost in below freezing weather?.......The Ford e-Mach is rated worst with a 30% loss in range in below freezing temperatures......

EV vehicles are limited at best........IMO

no quibbles regards range, towing and cold weather drawbacks about EVs , but I highly suspect your info on battery longevity on the whole is inaccurate - sure you can find exceptions - just like on this board when a tranny or engine fails - you get reactions (overreactions ?), I do not find many youtube vids to be accurate sources of gross information - isolated exceptions notwithstanding. I'm sure there are early failures of Tesla batteries - if before 8yrs/100 k miles they get a new batt - if the drivetrain on a Ford fails after 5yr/60k you get nothing but a big repair bill. And there are reports of EVs batts failing there are reports of Teslas going well over 100k miles on original battery back.

Wouldn't buy a Ford Lightning even it was $20k lower, don't need that sized vehicle but wife's car is a 10 yr old Hyundai and it's replacement may well be an EV - several yrs down the road and I wouldn't be at all surprised if EV batteries are improved by then.

 

[SigOris]

Current EV’s are like the VIC20’s. I’ll hold out for the C64 version.

 

[dtech]

Current EV’s are like the VIC20’s. I’ll hold out for the C64 version.

Were you involved with computers ? I was and worked for digital equipment when they came out with a 64 bit chip - they thought it would save the company and it didn't.

 

[TJC]

Were you involved with computers ? I was and worked for digital equipment when they came out with a 64 bit chip - they thought it would save the company and it didn't.

DEC was a great company. RISC processors did em in... Then Compaq bought them, and the rest Is history. I honestly don't know how IBM has survived this long. Though they are a shell of what they were.

PS: the Vaxx line wasn't bad at all, It just that IBM had a near monopoly on that segment.

 

[dtech]

DEC was a great company. RISC processors did em in... Then Compaq bought them, and the rest Is history. I honestly don't know how IBM has survived this long. Though they are a shell of what they were.

Yeah I worked for DEC in storage engineering then went into sales, they were on a downslide and I was competing in a deal vs HP and called the competitive hotline for HP weaknesses, when the person said "we used to have some competitive advantages but don't anymore" I knew it was time to seek employment elsewhere . And I sold a VAX 9000 , DEC's air cooled answer to IBM mainframes, plagued by CPU overheating and got booted out of that account, lol.

just to add I went back to work for Compaq as a marketing mgr after they bought DEC, they were trying to figure out how to use DECs storage technology - which was solid - I lasted I think 6 weeks because Compaq only cared about selling pcs and windows servers, badly misled me about program funding and so on so I told them to stick where sun doesn't shine. But those 6 weeks qualified me for a pension.

 

[TJC]

Even more reason to consider buying an EV - if the battery pack lasts just 5 yrs - the US gov mandates an 8 yr /100k warranty , Cali even longer. Not sure where you get the 5 yr longevity period but I don't believe it's accurate, Prius are a good example. But might see shorter lifespans from that recently announced FoMoCo joint venture. Hyundai it's life of vehicle.

How long do EV battery packs last?

Consumer Reports estimates the average EV battery pack's lifespan to be at around 200,000 miles, which is nearly 17 years of use if driven 12,000 miles per year.

https://www.jdpower.com/cars/shopping-guides/how-long-do-electric-car-batteries-last

My friend's Nissan Leaf lasted 8 years, and they couldn't give it away! The basic 24 kWh battery was priced at $5K, and the bigger 60 kWh battery pack was $10,000. $2K more to install them.

They paid $8K for it used, and were looking at $7K and $12K plus 7.5% sales tax, depending on the battery, to get it back on the road. His daughter had it 2 years.

 

[dtech]

https://insideevs.com/news/578903/model-3-200000-miles/ https://www.cars.com/articles/your-...ure-death-range-loss-and-preservation-446126/

I don't doubt there are ev batteries that fail early but there are also increasing reports that most last beyond the warranty period which at a min in the us is 8yr/100k miles. Battery technology is continuing to improve, again I'm questioning the veracity that most ev batteries last only 5 yrs, I'd put that in the same category as people contending turbo charged engines aren't reliable and won't last 100k miles, or oil needs to changed every 3k. IIRC reconditioned battery packs at a lower cost are becoming available for some models. I wouldn't put a Nissan leaf or a Chevy bolt in the same class as tesla or ford, Nissan is a troubled company.

 

[TJC]

Nissan is a troubled company.

Yep, they are pulling all cars out of the US market. Before it is over they may leave the US market entirely.

 

[dtech]

So you are ready to pony up $88K for a Lightning?

I need to find the article I read about Tesla battery packs dying too soon......

Also, you did not address the range issue......

Another thing to consider......have you seen the data on how much charging/power capacity is lost in below freezing weather?.......The Ford e-Mach is rated worst with a 30% loss in range in below freezing temperatures......

EV vehicles are limited at best........IMO

Link to article regards towing 6,000 lb trailer - in ideal conditions, Ford Lightning goes 100 miles and I think it has the extra battery pack, so not a good use of an EV to make an understatement. I see EVs best suited for use as commuter vehicles - not in trucks but since Americans love trucks , they are being produced.

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a40896618/ev-pickups-towing-test-hummer-rivian-lightning/

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