Could this have damaged my front Dif?

[P. A. Schilke]

It makes me nervous about the future for sure. I’m surprised I didn’t catch it earlier. I’m sensitive to any kind of vibrations and the dam truck drove perfect. It still does.

I mean I didn’t feel a thing!

Hi Mitch,

As an excitation source for generating vibrations, I can see why it would not tickle your calibrated Assometer....

best,
Phil

Sponsored

 

[RecoilOperated]

It makes me nervous about the future for sure. I’m surprised I didn’t catch it earlier. I’m sensitive to any kind of vibrations and the dam truck drove perfect. It still does.

I mean I didn’t feel a thing!

Lucky you, my truck makes so many clunking noises from both ends I would never notice a missing bearing until it was too late.

 

[P. A. Schilke]

Lucky you, my truck makes so many clunking noises from both ends I would never notice a missing bearing until it was too late.

HI Phil,

Have you scheduled a visit to the dealer to address "so many: clunking noises? If not, why? Your truck should visit the dealer with your list of clunks for them to address.

best,
Phil

 

[D Fresh]

Hi Tracy,

Thank you so much for sending this alert....not sure I helped much but am familliar with design concept...Fellow should be okay, but Dana should be ashamed for not having a process to flag this glaring omission of hard parts.... Dana ran hot and cold during my days at Ford... Lost a lot of respect for them with the Dana 44 axle...seem the saga continues...Ford Sterling Axle was no picnic either, but heads above Dana...

best,
Phil

Curious as to your thoughts on the D44?

It's pretty well regarded in the Jeep community. In fact it was the go-to axle before folks started doing 1 ton D60 swaps.

 

[BladeRanger]

Hey guys!

I posted a thread a few days ago about having a front axle seal leak. Well I took it to Ford and they fixed and returned my truck. The needle bearing was missing completely from factory assembly and they replaced it and told me everything is fine. Truck is a tremor with 1300 miles on it. Has not been offroad yet.

i need someone to chime in here that’s smarter than me with this stuff. Could this cause damage to my front dif? Truck drives fine and shifts in and out of 4wd with no issues.

what the hell is a needle bearing anyways?

to the engineers or people who know this stuff that chime in thank you in advanced.

I'm reading through the thread, and wondering if Ford test the sub assemblies before installing them. I'm a RF Test Engineer and we can test components to modules and systems, I understand it's totally different in mechanical but Ford is been around for a long long time and sure have a processes and quality assurance that can track this kind of error.

 

[Cmar]

A lot of manufacturers these days rely on their "ISO 9001" certified suppliers and assume that their suppliers QC process will catch that sort of thing before it gets out the door, and so maybe only check one in 100 or 1 in 1000 supplied parts randomly or perhaps just a hand full from each lot.

However in this case all parts should be numbered so Ford's quality system should be able to identify which production lot of vehicles used that particular delivery of diff assemblies, and notify dealers and customers to have their cars checked.

 

[Mokume]

If it ran without long enough, then yes. I would guess that not using 4wd allowed it to run as long as it did. The seal most likely kept it centered well enough until it wore as evidenced by the leaking. The axle spline and carrier internal spline might also see wear but it was probably caught before being damaged.

The old dodge dakota front axles had bronze bushings and know of one that wore to the point where the bushing was destroyed and the housing was damaged. The owner epoxied a new bushing in place and the truck is still going strong.

Are you serious? Chrysler used a bushing instead of a bearing to support the axle (and therefore the vehicle)?
I though Ford was cheap...

 

[jss81258]

Are you serious? Chrysler used a bushing instead of a bearing to support the axle (and therefore the vehicle)?
I though Ford was cheap...

Yes, serious but the bushing only supports the axle shaft. So the axle with CV joints slide into the housing. The splined end is supported by the differential carrier and the end closest to the CV joints is supported by a bushing or bearing in the axle housing. The opposite end slides through the spindle and drives the wheel. So the spindle supports the vehicle. The differential housing with the axle housings just hang there. And the CV joints are to allow movement of the suspension and steering in relation to the fixed differential/axle housing.

My point really is that the bushing was so worn out that the housing was also worn and wouldn't allow for a bushing to be press fit as it should. So, the owner epoxied the new bushing in place and the truck is still in use. The only damage was to the bushing, housing and seal. The owner re-used the axle. I think this was like 12 years ago or so.

All this tells me that it takes quite a bit to damage the components beyond a simple repair.

And I agree, using a bushing was a really cheap way doing it.

 

[WOADKIL]

Can't do much without a driveshaft.

what She said…

 

[P. A. Schilke]

Curious as to your thoughts on the D44?

It's pretty well regarded in the Jeep community. In fact it was the go-to axle before folks started doing 1 ton D60 swaps.

Hi Doug,

Terrible pitch line runout...NVH nightmare...we cracked down on them and they got much better.

best,
Phil

 

[D Fresh]

Hi Doug,

Terrible pitch line runout...NVH nightmare...we cracked down on them and they got much better.

best,
Phil

Thanks, can't say that I've heard of pitch line runout problems. However, NVH doesn't really apply to Jeeps.

 

[THLONE]

Nothing wrong with bushings. Remember Ford twin I beam and others. Needle bearings are better and more expensive. Covered wagons had leather and fat grease. Bushings are used on connecting rods, crankshafts, and more. You have to assume that the bearing surface on the axle was not damaged.

 

[BladeRanger]

I'm sure a QA system is in place at both Ford and Dana, but clearly it failed.
I deal with QA all the time and they can be only as good as their paperwork and process', most of them have no idea what you are doing, but the paperwork says this and that and that's all they know.

in this case, there should have been an inventory for a build at least, and not released until all parts were accounted for as installed. but clearly they don't have that kind of process.

bar coding makes this process much more accurate, as long as everything is scanned at each step. from inventory to install, you know what was scanned and what wasn't.

somewhere along this trail of despair, there likely was a cleaner, sweeping floors at the end of the day, wondering what this bearing was for, all covered in dust and pubes and cookie crumbs, and simply tossed it into the daily trash.
meanwhile a distracted worker, thinking about his Mom dying of covid went through the steps of installing it, but his phone rang with important information and he took the call. forgetting all about the bearing, and not going back two steps to make sure he didn't miss anything when he returned.

Human factors affect all of us at some point.

Need some automation for testing to eliminate some human errors, hopefully Ford can fix your rig or give you a new one, cause the Ranger is very capable rig and hoping to last for a long time.

 

[RecoilOperated]

HI Phil,

Have you scheduled a visit to the dealer to address "so many: clunking noises? If not, why? Your truck should visit the dealer with your list of clunks for them to address.

best,
Phil

I plan to once I get home in a couple weeks; I'm out of state for work and bought the truck while here. I don't mean to come across as a whiner just being negative for the sake of it. This is my third Ford and I'm really trying to like the truck, I've just never had a brand new vehicle feel and sound like so many things are loose. I even had to tighten down the nuts on the driver's seat frame because it would pop every time I got in and out and I'm by no means a heavy person. I guess I figured by the third year of production most of the teething issues would have been worked out of the production line.

 

[Cmar]

Nothing wrong with bushings. Remember Ford twin I beam and others. Needle bearings are better and more expensive. Covered wagons had leather and fat grease. Bushings are used on connecting rods, crankshafts, and more. You have to assume that the bearing surface on the axle was not damaged.

Covered wagons went at 5MPH, bushings in engines internals are force fed oil under pressure and apart from startup should never experience metal on metal contact.
Axles rely on splash lubrication like most needle roller applications, apart from sealed bearings.

Still there probably wasn't probably a lot of damage as the seal probably held it centered.
But contrary to earlier posts being in 4WD or not makes little difference the front end in these units turns all the time anyway.

Sponsored