E Bikes exploding

[OrangeStreak]

So does Paul @OrangeStreak when he eats Taco Bell. ? ?

That was a Jeep that I smoked with the Ranger...

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[Langwilliams]

Better than the Prez falling

I read where people were adding the spot he fell on google maps as "Bidenfalls" an they keep taking it down

 

[N559br]

I remember when LiPos first came out and hit the RC airplane groups. The club rules we we had to charge the packs in a fireproof environment. Had a lot of fires at the beginning. Some guys ended up buying small safes.

 

[txquailguy]

It's these cheap knock-off ebikes with the lithium battery technology from Istanbul.....lol.
Seriously, I guess a lot of these companies use very suspect lithium technology in their batteries...BOOM!
...
Moral of the story seems to be.....don't buy ebikes on Amazon....lol...

 

[dtech]

https://www.cbsnews.com/newyork/new...m-ion-batteries-blamed-for-hundreds-of-fires/

 

[N559br]

In addition to the airplanes, i do own a homebuilt E-Bile. Carbon fiber, fat tire with Bafang BBSHD drivetrain. As far as batteries go, I only buy packs with sanyo cells. Only machine soldered, with a high end BMS. I've got 56v, 14AH pack and the motor is rated at 1000w. So I take it very seriously, I never charge above 1C and the BMS will shut down the charge if the temp sensor is triggered.

Now some of these ebike mfgs that Amazon has decided to allow on the site might be hand soldering, creating hot spots, or using sub par BMS chips. I've been building bikes a long time and do my research. The average Joe blow is buying on price and sees a 350w hub motor bike with batt pack for sub $900 jumps on it and finds out its just a banana seat Schwinn with a cheap battery pack that can't be charged above 1/2c but the charger isn't sampling. So the pack heats, and theses LiPos love to catch fire.


Stick with a name brand bike if you want guarantees.

 

[TJC]

In cars, they're so much bigger and more expensive that the relative value of taking those steps is a good bit more important.

Don't they use the same 18650 battery (or slightly modified variants) in both eBikes and EVs? It is simply a matter of quantity in the EV battery. I think a better name for an EV Battery is EV Battery Pack.

I am sure that EVs have more sophisticated monitoring systems, but the technology is basically the same.

 

[mtbikernate]

Don't they use the same 18650 battery (or slightly modified variants) in both eBikes and EVs? It is simply a matter of quantity in the EV battery. I think a better name for an EV Battery is EV Battery Pack.

I am sure that EVs have more sophisticated monitoring systems, but the technology is basically the same.

It's the monitoring and management systems specifically that I was referring to. Because those are what helps keep a lithium battery from going critical. And those are the things that cheap ebike batteries often lack entirely. Your more expensive name brand ebikes are much, much more likely to include better safety systems for those batteries. But that amazon special that costs 1/4 as much? Fat chance.

But also on the horizon are changes to the battery chemistry itself. Those slight changes to battery chemistry are going to show up on more expensive batteries first. Again, your cheap amazon special isn't going to be including any of that cutting edge stuff. And you already do see slight variations in battery chemistry among different EV manufacturers as some of those options become viable for production. Some of those improve the safety of the batteries.

 

[Zaph]

The "E-bike" I'm looking at is a Sur Ron X. It is relatively high performance (45 mph top speed), It straddles a line between bike and motorcycle (no pedals) and is not road legal or bike trail legal anywhere - especially with the pedal nazis patrolling. You basically treat it like a skinny light weight and quiet dirt bike.

About $5K.

While this bike is very well made with good suspension components and a beautiful cast aluminum frame and swingarm, I'm sure at only $5K for this it still qualifies as cheap Chinese junk. If this were made in the USA it would be a $15K bike. As such when I charge, it will be in my garage, which is dry with a tall ceiling, and I'll put it in the middle well away from everything else including vehicles and walls.

I'm a gas engine lover through and through. I'm not about to turn to e-bikes because of some climate agenda or political statement. I've rode one of these things. The fun is off the freaking charts. Highly recommend even for experienced dirt bike riders. If I get a few years out of it before it inevitably breaks or explodes, I will consider it a great purchase.

 

[mtbikernate]

It straddles a line between bike and motorcycle

that straddles no line. it's a motorcycle.

 

[Zaph]

that straddles no line. it's a motorcycle.

You can get an optional pedal kit for it. A good portion of the components are catalog mountain bike parts. Forks, brakes, wheel hubs, etc. I am not the person that came up with the statement that it straddles the line between motorcycle and bike. Reviewers have.

IMHO this is an electric dirt bike. About 5 or 6 times the HP, about 2.5 times the weight, and triple the cost. But IMHO, not at all more fun than my CFR450R, so I don't see the point. It's the actual "straddling" that makes the Sur Ron X special. It's lighter and more maneuverable like an e-bike, but unlike an e-bike this thing can make it up a hill under it's own power. The KTM Freeride E-XC is a full size dirt bike but it is over weight and under powered compared to a regular dirt bike.

So basically, I love how the Sur Ron X sits between e-bikes and electric motorcycles. ? You gotta admit it's a cool idea whatever you want to call it.

 

[Langwilliams]

not road legal or bike trail legal anywhere

$5K for this it still qualifies as cheap Chinese junk.

My son built an E bike from components he purchased to add to a bike he had. It was still like $3500 an that was at least 5 or 6 years ago. He has 4 kids an he put a cheap motor kit on his wife's bike since she had a baby seat an a tow behind stroller. They kicked her out of the metro parks here because no motorized vehicles of any kind are allowed. My son has a regular manual only bike for rec riding an he commuted to work on the E bike.

Not everything made in China is junk. Most probably is. The exception is when a US owned company sets up shop there an controls production an engineering an just uses their cheap labor.

I'm for having all American owned businesses divest from China but they're making too much money an our politicians are owned by Chinese money an won't do anything to reduce it. We are funding our biggest threat an no one cares.

 

[Zaph]

They kicked her out of the metro parks here because no motorized vehicles of any kind are allowed.

Ah yeah, the pedal bikers strike again. They have serious hate for anything motorized. Allow me to explain.

What goes on in their mind: "I worked HARD to get the fitness level that I got to today to be able to pedal this hard and this fast to obtain this speed. You have some NERVE just bypassing that effort and training, and just BUYING your fitness with an e-bike and now you can go FASTER than me without even PEDALING? You fat ass lazy F@#$!. I am going to take all my biking friends, march down to city hall, and DEMAND that they pass laws and post signs saying NO motorized vehicles of ANY type, and we don't care what size battery or motor is on that thing, if it's got one, get it the F#$% out of here. You want to ride a bike around here, you MUST EXPEND MASSIVE EFFORT. Otherwise get your lazy ass out of here."

What comes out of their mouth: "Uhh... HEY! you can't, uh, ride that around here!"

Note that I'm a former triathlete and mountain bike racer. (no, really) Then I discovered I could go faster with less effort. A few years later you can find me going 170 mph on the front straight of Road America. This might belong in the jokes section. ?

 

[mtbikernate]

You can get an optional pedal kit for it.

That still doesn't help it to straddle any lines. Under all legal definitions for ebikes used in the United States, that thing does not fit as an ebike. At best, you can call it a moped if you put the pedal kit on it. But there's no line straddling anywhere with that machine.

Ah yeah, the pedal bikers strike again.

You're pretty much full of shit. The laws on the books now existed LONG before ebikes ever did. In a LOT of places, trail access was WON for mountain bikes by using the argument that they were nonmotorized. So a LOT of trails exist under that definition and mt bikers are rightfully concerned about all bikes being kicked out because it can be hard to tell the difference between a motorized ebike and a nonmotorized one (I've lost count of the number of times I've been asked that specific question in the past couple years, from ppl who know enough to know that ebikes exist, but not enough to know how to tell the difference). Now ebikes show up and muddy the waters. Some smaller land managers were nimble and able to adjust definitions a little bit to allow them, at least in some places. Other land managers are not so nimble and are taking longer to figure things out. The USFS only adjusted its own definitions last year. Under those definitions, ebikes are STILL considered motorized, but under their own specific category of motorized. The mechanisms are in place for the USFS to allow ONLY that level of motorized use for nonmotorized trails, but as is the case for every designation change for the USFS, there's a process for that to happen and I don't know any place that has yet completed that process.

Still, the Surron is NOT included in that, and it would be excluded from those trails because of its relatively high power. The fact that pedal kits can be purchased tells me that Surron as a manufacturer is attempting to convince customers that these flirt with some definition that would give them increased access, and in that the manufacturer is blatantly attempting to deceive customers. The pedal kits don't change the legal definition of what they are (set by power output and existence of a throttle). Surrons are NOT ebikes under the legal definitions set forth, and therefore cannot ride in places where ebikes are allowed where all other uses are required to be nonmotorized. You can ride them in offroad parks with the dirt bikes. Because that's what it is. A lightweight, low-powered dirt bike. Which is fine for what it is. Electric motorcycles interest me, and ebikes interest me (specifically urban ones like cargo bikes), but I'm not pretending these things are something they aren't.

 

[myothercarizahearse]

Regular bikes are safe...

so that's how you park...?

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