Tesla Model S 'Spontaneously' Catches Fire, Requires 6,000 Gallons Of Water To Extinguish

[Gazmic]

I would imagine that lithium, much like other metal fires (magnesium, titanium) can't be put out with water. I'm pretty sure water makes the fire worse!

 

[Jhbryaniv]

I would imagine that lithium, much like other metal fires (magnesium, titanium) can't be put out with water. I'm pretty sure water makes the fire worse!

I was reading some firefighting blog posts earlier and it talked about the gas that is put off by lithium battery fires, one of which is oxygen which is what makes them so difficult to put out...

 

[TJC]

Yup. lots of IF's for sure. But look at memory on your computer.
I remember switching out 4k to 8 k memory WOOHOO!!! It may
or may not work but I'd like an EV, just not now.
Mr Fusion is sold out! That sucks!!!!

Moore's law at work. Evolutionary change in progress. The technology wasn't changed, simply refined over time.

The EV challenges are going to require Revolutionary changes. New technology entirely. They are never going to get to 5 minute 100% full charge time without new battery tech, and a massive increase in electrical power plants. The US power grid is old and is barely sufficient for our present population.

I want a Mr Fusion too!

- T

 

[Jhbryaniv]

I also read about some new fire fighting tools for ev fires - one was essentially a spike you slide under the vehicle, it punctures the bottom of the battery and sprays water inside the battery packaging.

This tech could put out a battery fire in as little as 500 gallons.

Tomorrow from the office I'll post the links.

 

[Fordup]

I also read about some new fire fighting tools for ev fires - one was essentially a spike you slide under the vehicle, it punctures the bottom of the battery and sprays water inside the battery packaging.

This tech could put out a battery fire in as little as 500 gallons.

Tomorrow from the office I'll post the links.

Years ago we used a halon system in our main frame computer room and I know it's banned now but if the battery case could have a system like that it sure would be better then punching a hole in the battery. Guess a fire suppression system should be made a requirement for EV's like airbags.

 

[CB750F]

0UCH!!!! Is PHEV still worth it?

https://www.theepochtimes.com/fuel-...n=ZeroHedge&src_src=partner&src_cmp=ZeroHedge

Getting back to excess water use to put out an EV in the desert. Yes.
Maybe they should get a truck with a crane & pool on the back & just pickup & drop in pool?

 

[AzScorpion]

0UCH!!!! Is PHEV still worth it?

https://www.theepochtimes.com/fuel-...n=ZeroHedge&src_src=partner&src_cmp=ZeroHedge

Getting back to excess water use to put out an EV in the desert. Yes.
Maybe they should get a truck with a crane & pool on the back & just pickup & drop in pool?

I saw that the other day. Only problem now is gas is rising again and soon enough it'll cost more to run an iCE than a EV. But don't worry once electric rates increase and they start paying the road taxes they're avoiding now the EV price per mile will shoot right back up there.

 

[rydfree]

Your absolutely right, the ICE was so much better. Now if EVs become 50% cheaper then ICE & can go 500 miles & full charge in 5 mins, what would you buy?

If a battery could take a full charge in 5 minutes then the tech would exist for it to recharge itself as it rolled down the highway. LOL

 

[rydfree]

I saw that the other day. Only problem now is gas is rising again and soon enough it'll cost more to run an iCE than a EV. But don't worry once electric rates increase and they start paying the road taxes they're avoiding now the EV price per mile will shoot right back up there.

The power company here has had 3 rate increases within the last year. The latest one cost the company I work for an extra $44k per month. I wonder who ends up paying for that

 

[TJC]

I would imagine that lithium, much like other metal fires (magnesium, titanium) can't be put out with water. I'm pretty sure water makes the fire worse!

Time for a war story! You don't realize how special a time is until you have perspective. You are too deep in the trees to see the forest. It has a little ( just a little ) to do with the EV susceptability to fire.

As a 16 year old teenager, I had a very unique job building 1/12 scale model trains. My employer had 3 High School kids working for him. I was the lead teen. We built 1/12 scale trains in the man's basement. He was the only person that I knew who had a basement in South Florida. And he built it expressly for making trains.

We used old surplus WWII aircraft landing gear motors (4 on each a typical locomotive). The motor housing were made out of magnesium or a magnesium alloy (I was told magnesium). The job was an excellent experience and I learned a great deal. We fabricated everything except those motors... which we rewired. I learned to operate machine shop tools, milling castings - train couplers, gearbox housings, the cast iron wheels. The axles, wheels, coil springs, journal boxes, bearings, and gear boxes came to gether to make the truck assemblies. All designed and built in my boss's small basement. These were significant and complex machines.

So what does this have to do with EV's catching fire? I had learned that magnesium would burn if heated hot enough. I had just finished machining a batch of those aircraft landing gear motors to mate to our brass (also cast and machined) gearbox housing.

What's a 17 year old to do with those spent magnesium shavings? Experiment! I found a steel spray paint can cap and filled it half way up with magnesium shavings, placed the cap on a wood stool and took a propane torch to it. I then patiently waited to see what would happen. , The metal started off red, transitioned to yellow, but still had not ignited. But boy when it did it burned white hot. I started to panic when I noticed the steel cap also glowing as it appeared to be sinking into the wood stool seat. I ran upstairs and grabbed a small glass of water. Time to set out the flame before it gets out of control! I hadn't poured more than an ounce of water before everything went bright white!

As soon as that water touched the magnesium all hell broke loose in a BRIGHT white Flash! No noise at all just a blinding white flash!. When I could finally refocus, I noticed what looked like "snowflakes" in the air all around me, slowly setting to the ground. The fire had been extinguished by blowing up! The bottom third of steel cap was gone and the stool had a nice round hole the size of the cap burned 1/2" down into it. The entire episode was very short - less than a minute once it ignited to when I ignorantly initiated "the blast". That was the first and only experience that I had with igniting magnesium.

I suspect that something similar happens with EV batteries.

Just for the fun of it all... here are a few pictures of the engines and cars I was privileged to be a part of the building. This is a HS friend who handled the admin. Gives you an idea of scale.

This F Unit combo (FA, FB, FA) all powered could pull 50 cars loaded with people up a 3% grade. We completed this as a Christmas gift to a customer in Dec 1973.

This monster Steamer was completed in 1972. We had to increase our track radius to keep it from jumping the track. 3500 lbs and it was a bear to move and place on the track.

I saw this unit for sale 5 years ago , and almost purchased it. It was the last unit that I was involved in. It has held up well for being 48+ years old!

More details of the unit above. I machined and built the trucks in the lower right picture.

And attached is part of a manual that shows how we scaled the unit down, and a short TV video from a local station of one of my Boss, Bill K at his home during a miniature train meet from the mid 1970s.. Bill is 90+ and still building scale railroads, only much much smaller now (N Scale). We touch base 3 or 4 times a year.

Forgive the my nostalgic detour, back to our regularly scheduled discussion on EVs!

- T

 

[AzScorpion]

If a battery could take a full charge in 5 minutes then the tech would exist for it to recharge itself as it rolled down the highway. LOL

I wish I saved it but I did read an article a while back saying they're working on this. It'll be similar to a pull off access road on the highway and you'll be able to fast charge and get right back on the highway without ever stopping. But there's a huge cost in all of this and someone's going to pay for it.

 

[TJC]

I wish I saved it but I did read an article a while back saying they're working on this. It'll be similar to a pull off access road on the highway and you'll be able to fast charge and get right back on the highway without ever stopping. But there's a huge cost in all of this and someone's going to pay for it.

That would be an impressive feat of technology! Think about the power required to do this on a massive scale.

The US Interstate system alone is 50,000 miles of =>4 lanes of road surface. Think about the retrofit and operational costs. Maintenance of roadway, electronics, and power requirements.

I have visions of Mr Fusion again. Or maybe Mr Fission!

- T

 

[AzScorpion]

That would be an impressive feat of technology! Think about the power required to do this on a massive scale.

I found it. I'm not sure if it's the same article but it looks like it is. Yes it'll be very impressive if they can do this across the country and still keep in reasonably priced.

https://news.yahoo.com/highway-could-charge-electric-vehicle-031345605.html?fr=sycsrp_catchall

Next spring, the nation’s first mile of public road that can charge electric vehicles as they drive over it will go online in Detroit.
A joint venture between the Michigan Department of Transportation (MDOT) and Israeli mobility startup Electreon, the road is the centerpiece of a $5.7 million program to study how charging roads in dense urban environments affect everyday life.

The technology is the same used to wirelessly charge a smartphone—on a much larger scale. A box connects magnetic coils embedded into asphalt to the power grid, and those coils then emit a magnetic field that is picked up by a receiver mounted to an EV’s chassis. The road isn’t meant to bring an EV back from empty: It charges at 20 kilowatts, roughly the same consumption rate an EV uses at highway speeds. The receiver can be installed on the assembly line or as an aftermarket accessory, and will work both in motion and while the vehicle is parked.

 

[rydfree]

I wish I saved it but I did read an article a while back saying they're working on this. It'll be similar to a pull off access road on the highway and you'll be able to fast charge and get right back on the highway without ever stopping. But there's a huge cost in all of this and someone's going to pay for it.

If 1/10 of the tech I read in Popular Mechanics as a kid had come to fruition we would be living on Mars driving fusion powered Rangers right now

 

[TJC]

One wonders how the EMF will affect wildlife and people over time. I think US standards right now are very low. Belgium has stopped the rollout of 5G due to the science pointing to exposure risks. The US has historically lagged the EU and the Russians in this area of safety standards.

Brussels halts 5G deployment indefinitely: 5G project, says authorities, not compatible with radiation safety standards

New evidence for a human magnetic sense that lets your brain detect the Earth’s magnetic field

- T