Ranger shopping

slm

Well-Known Member
First Name
Steven
Joined
Jul 30, 2021
Threads
5
Messages
93
Reaction score
138
Location
Canada
Vehicle(s)
Ranger XLT Supercab (on order)
Hi Everyone,

I’m not currently a Ranger owner, but have been shopping mid-size trucks since forever. I like to do a very in-depth research when shopping, and besides, looking at trucks is always fun! I currently own a 2010 Jeep Patriot, and regardless of the bad reviews it has gotten, it hasn’t been too bad. The AWD system it has does great in the snow, it has been pretty reliable, never been stranded or anything like that, but I did have to do some suspension work at around 75000km, which was too early in my opinion (it currently has 157000km and my kids are sharing it now) and changed the computer more recently (ouch, was expensive!)

After many many many (a whole lot !) of spec comparisons, spreadsheet cost analysis, trips to various dealers (Toyota, GM, Ford), the Ranger (supercab, fx4, maybe with 302A pkg) is at the top of the list. My needs are very modest, pulling an aluminum fishing boat and getting out there in the outdoors, the Ranger should be more than capable enough! My plan is to keep this truck as long as possible, so long term reliability is my priority.

Having followed several threads here on ranger5g, I currently only have 2 concerns: the "Fuel in oil" issue (I went through every page/post in the thread) and the recent "Holes in the rocker panel" issue seen on 2021 models. I visited 2 different Ford dealers yesterday, one had three 2020 models (demo vehicles) and the other had four 2021 models (supercrew and supercab) - the 2021 all had the holes in the rocker panels, 2020 models were plugged. I can’t see how this isn’t something other than an issue on the production line. Those holes in the rocker panels will for sure getting filled up with snow/ice/road salt in the winter.

For the fuel in oil issue, well I don’t think it’s every single Ranger out there but with everything that has been tried to fix the problem on trucks that do have it, it’s a bit worrying that no one has pin-pointed the issue and determined a proper fix. I really hope Ford will find a solution.

Having said that, I have emailed Ford Canada with my concerns with these two issues specifically and I’m waiting to hear back from them. I also brought up the removal of certain features that were part of the 2019 model year (wiper de-icer, 6 vs 4 tie-downs, etc.) in the form of “feedback”, and how (in my opinion) it’s not a good strategy if they’re looking to increase market share in the mid size truck market.

Hopefully everything will work out and I’ll order a Ranger in the near future.
Sponsored

 

dondonbabyraptor

Well-Known Member
First Name
Brandon
Joined
Jan 27, 2021
Threads
41
Messages
2,168
Reaction score
6,124
Location
San Diego
Vehicle(s)
2020 Ford Ranger Lariat
Occupation
I/O Psych MSc student
Hey Steven, looks like you do your research before buying a car and very thoroughly. Very good for you to know exactly what you want. The Ranger has excellent towing capabilities for a mid size truck and gets great mileage at the same time. If it makes you more confident in a decision, the Ranger is tested to run to 150k miles within the 90th percentile. With that in mind, and the warranty you should be just fine if you don’t drive like a bat out of hell like a few folks here do.

In regards to your rocker panels having holes, a few of the threads have a link to buy a $20 set of plugs that will fit the holes iirc. Having eased your mind on two of your direct problems I hope you return and join us for some fun on these forums. It’s a great community here and the Ranger will keep you smiling :sun:
 

Grumpaw

Well-Known Member
First Name
Steve
Joined
Jul 1, 2021
Threads
70
Messages
4,278
Reaction score
20,020
Location
Fishersville, Va.
Vehicle(s)
2021 Ranger Lariat Sport Supercab
Occupation
Navy Vet., Retired Police Sgt.
No 2021 has the plugs...just holes.
$9.99 on Amazon will get you a bag of 25 rubber hole plugs, 3/4 inch...problem solved. Before plugging holes get some PTFE spray lube..stuff they use to lube garage door hardware...dosen't run and dries to a non hardening waxy coating....shoot a bunch in each hole, plug em...problem solved. :like:
To take it one step further, I had planned to get the bottom of the rockers coated with bed liner when I had my bed done, but was cost prohibitive.
What I plan to do before winter is to buy a quart of bed liner coating, about $19.00. tape up below the door where it can't be seen, and brush on the liner coating over the plugs I installed, and down to cover the pinch weld. Will/should never have to worry about anything getting thru that into the rocker void. $30 bucks = piece of mind and better than anything the factory could have done.
 
Last edited:

MoatCarp

Active Member
First Name
Nathan
Joined
Jul 12, 2021
Threads
2
Messages
42
Reaction score
118
Location
Houston, Texas
Vehicle(s)
2019 Ranger Lariat FX4
Occupation
IT Systems Administrator
...If it makes you more confident in a decision, the Ranger is tested to run to 150k miles within the 90th percentile...
I'm sorry, What does this part mean? 90% of Rangers will make it to 150k miles?
 

RedlandRanger

Moderator
First Name
Rob
Joined
Nov 14, 2018
Threads
35
Messages
4,592
Reaction score
8,826
Location
Oregon
Vehicle(s)
2019 Ford Ranger Lariat FX4, 1973 Mercury Capri
Vehicle Showcase
1
I'm sorry, What does this part mean? 90% of Rangers will make it to 150k miles?
I will most likely butcher the explanation, but the way I understood Phil explaining it is they use a "90% customer" which is a customer who uses the vehicles extremely hard. The test to ensure that one of those customers will have a vehicle survive 150k. So a "normal" owner can expect it to last significantly longer than that.
 


Jmarler

Well-Known Member
First Name
Jimmy
Joined
Jul 12, 2021
Threads
36
Messages
436
Reaction score
1,379
Location
San Antonio
Vehicle(s)
2021 ranger
Occupation
Certified Hacker. Retired Veteran
The fuel in oil thing is an ecoboost thing. If you research f150 with the ecoboost engine, you'll see the same concerns. My wife's car has the engine and the oil smells like gas and it's has no engine issues as of right now. I'm honestly not worried about it like I was at first. I also bought my ranger certified preowned with only 1499 miles so it came with extended warranty. So if you're looking at just new ones, I would take at look the low mile cpo ones. Mine still has the new smell to it.
 

dondonbabyraptor

Well-Known Member
First Name
Brandon
Joined
Jan 27, 2021
Threads
41
Messages
2,168
Reaction score
6,124
Location
San Diego
Vehicle(s)
2020 Ford Ranger Lariat
Occupation
I/O Psych MSc student
I will most likely butcher the explanation, but the way I understood Phil explaining it is they use a "90% customer" which is a customer who uses the vehicles extremely hard. The test to ensure that one of those customers will have a vehicle survive 150k. So a "normal" owner can expect it to last significantly longer than that.
If it's talking in terms of percentile, it generally would mean that 90 percent of users will experience 150k miles+, the last 10th percentile might be abnormalities in the normal trend of data like users who mod, off road a lot or drive it extremely hard or odd or just plain factory components poor quality, anything really. IIRC they tested in an industrious setting to model users who use it like a work truck. So if you drive it normally you will have a very very decent chance at making it there without major repairs. @MoatCarp , hope this makes sense if I am understanding it correctly. Wish I could find Phil's original post to re-read it but in the stats department this is what percentiles would generally mean.
 

RedlandRanger

Moderator
First Name
Rob
Joined
Nov 14, 2018
Threads
35
Messages
4,592
Reaction score
8,826
Location
Oregon
Vehicle(s)
2019 Ford Ranger Lariat FX4, 1973 Mercury Capri
Vehicle Showcase
1
If it's talking in terms of percentile, it generally would mean that 90 percent of users will experience 150k miles+, the last 10th percentile might be abnormalities in the normal trend of data like users who mod, off road a lot or drive it extremely hard or odd or just plain factory components poor quality, anything really. IIRC they tested in an industrious setting to model users who use it like a work truck. So if you drive it normally you will have a very very decent chance at making it there without major repairs. @MoatCarp , hope this makes sense if I am understanding it correctly. Wish I could find Phil's original post to re-read it but in the stats department this is what percentiles would generally mean.
But the percentile was talking about what type of USAGE it gets. So in that context 90th percentile means only 10% of customers would use the vehicle harder or in more harsh environments that what was tested with. So they are basically trying to use a worst case usage to get to the 150k.

Yeah, I wish I could find Phil's explanation of it as well, but the way I recall it, the testing was WAY beyond what the vast majority of users will use their trucks.
 

JTDay

Well-Known Member
First Name
Josh
Joined
Dec 7, 2020
Threads
3
Messages
331
Reaction score
760
Location
Georgia
Vehicle(s)
Mazdaspeed3, M3
Occupation
EHS
Have you driven them yet? I think a lot of us did a lot of research before our purchase decision so my advice is to go drive one and scrutinize the ride, seating position, and infotainment. You may have already done so. If you like the way it rides and drives, then you can't go wrong. The Ranger embarrasses the other trucks in spec comparisons aside from not offering a manual. Imho.
 

Dr. Zaius

Well-Known Member
First Name
Dennis
Joined
Dec 20, 2019
Threads
61
Messages
4,732
Reaction score
27,782
Location
GA
Vehicle(s)
2019 Ranger XLT FX4
I thought the 90th percentile was users who were using the vehicle to 90% capacity and still maintaining 150k durability.

OP, my truck had the fuel in oil issue and on mine the HPFP seems to have resolved it completely.

6k miles since the pump was replaced and oil level hasn't budged.
 

tremorman

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 19, 2021
Threads
8
Messages
136
Reaction score
345
Location
New England
Vehicle(s)
2021 Ford Ranger Lariat Tremor
Here is Phil's direct quote:

https://www.ranger5g.com/forum/threads/thinking-about-purchasing-a-ranger.12296/page-3

HI John,

I am happy you brought up this question as it has several aspects of which I will address a few.

Okay...a 90 percentile customer runs a mining company, a courtier service in Los Angeles stop and go traffic, servicing oil rigs in an oil field. In other words, beating the crap out of the truck way beyond what you would imagine. We instrument vehicles in these environments for loads, accelerations and stess/strains. From this we calculate cumulative fatigue damage and from this data we refine our durability to mirror 150,000 of the vehicles we see after the users turn them in to us. I suspect you do not beat the shit out of your vehicle every day like these users do. So 90 percentile means there are 10% worse customers that are above to which we strive to meet at 150,000 miles. This is why I am proud when 4G Rangers report 200 to 300, 000 miles in their Rangers before they sell them.

So...lets talk durability testing. This is not one truck that we test. It is program specific but encompasses quite a few vehicles. Each Prototype vehicle built goes through a sign off process.
Notice is sent to each design engineer for each vehicle to sign off their components. This is a pain for the engineers as it disrupts their day and many do not sign off the prototypes except for durability prototypes as a component failure or anomaly results in their devotion to the problem, So NVH vehicle...yeah...yada, yada...the NVH people will sort it out. Durability...not on your life will you get a pass if a problem is identified... So each prototype vehicle gets a Hoist review in the Experimental Garage. There is a documented process that each system is a go for Durability testing...maybe over time 12 to 15 vehicles depending...(numbers change per program) but not just one vehicle. Engineers visit, inspect and more importantly ensure that proper torque is applied to their attachment fasteners. Example is the rear axle suspension engineer. He/she will request a torque check on the build. Then the engineer signs off. So if there is a problem and the durability flags an issue, and there is no sign off recorded from the engineer, he will catch hell from his boss on up the chain. Durability signoffs are not take lightly or blown off for the most part.

Okay, I may have told this before...On the PN96 program, F Series redesign. I was in CAE at the time and alerted to a dash panel cracking around the brake booster. Almost impossible to see, but I recalled the Miserable Mustang II dash cracking on manual trans vehicles, I request a review of all durability vehicles...The test engineer in Arizona protested but in the end they developed a system to inspect the vehicles. Almost 95% of the test vehicles had cracks. So I marched over to the Body Engineering Supervisor...a good guy and delivered the results, which I backed up with CAE analysis. I could have taken arrows in the back but Matt had his act together, and between our CAE input and his direction to his engineers we strengthened the dash panel (I know...you call it a firewall). Today when I see a PN96 vintage vehicle on the road, I know it is a sound vehicle... PN 96 was job #1 1996, but the 96 has no bearing on model year, purely a coincidence.

Best,
Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retired
 
OP
OP

slm

Well-Known Member
First Name
Steven
Joined
Jul 30, 2021
Threads
5
Messages
93
Reaction score
138
Location
Canada
Vehicle(s)
Ranger XLT Supercab (on order)
Thanks for the replies everyone !

Regarding the holes in the rocker panels, I agree that we could order the plugs and fix ourselves (with some rust proofing sprayed in there first), and if push comes to shove I would do that, but it just seems wrong, like in an abnormal production sense (at least to me). I would like to hear what Ford’s pronouncement on the matter is, for reassurance. I guess I’m also secretly hoping my email will be news to them and for warning them of the issue, they’ll in turn give me a free ranger :)

That’s very interesting of the 90% testing target, and is a great stat they achieved (hope I’m understanding it correctly). I love hearing about the engineering behind a product, thanks for including the original post.

Regarding the oil in fuel issue from what I’ve read, to a certain extent, it’s a byproduct of the direct injection engine design and might be exacerbated by the turbo in an EcoBoost engine. Please correct me if I’m wrong (I often am). In the thread though, it sure sounds like the fuel level is too high. Makes sense that at a certain point, the dilution starts to reduce the oil viscosity to the point where the engine is not being lubricated enough. Perhaps the oil change interval makes this a non issue, which is fine, but I’d love to hear Ford tell us that.

I started looking for methods/techniques to reduce the carbon build up behind the valves (also a result of direct injection), and read better gas and using full synthetic oil will help but we should expect a maintenance (somewhere around 100k miles) to de-coke the valves, such as using the walnut shell blast method. Not sure if that’s true or not, but if it is, I’m ok with that - if it provides another 100k trouble free miles! :)
 
OP
OP

slm

Well-Known Member
First Name
Steven
Joined
Jul 30, 2021
Threads
5
Messages
93
Reaction score
138
Location
Canada
Vehicle(s)
Ranger XLT Supercab (on order)
Have you driven them yet? I think a lot of us did a lot of research before our purchase decision so my advice is to go drive one and scrutinize the ride, seating position, and infotainment. You may have already done so. If you like the way it rides and drives, then you can't go wrong. The Ranger embarrasses the other trucks in spec comparisons aside from not offering a manual. Imho.
Yes I have test driven it and loved it !
 
OP
OP

slm

Well-Known Member
First Name
Steven
Joined
Jul 30, 2021
Threads
5
Messages
93
Reaction score
138
Location
Canada
Vehicle(s)
Ranger XLT Supercab (on order)
I thought the 90th percentile was users who were using the vehicle to 90% capacity and still maintaining 150k durability.

OP, my truck had the fuel in oil issue and on mine the HPFP seems to have resolved it completely.

6k miles since the pump was replaced and oil level hasn't budged.
That's good to hear, but I remember another member in the thread that had his HPFP changed and it hadn't fixed the problem. Maybe he was really unlucky.
 

dondonbabyraptor

Well-Known Member
First Name
Brandon
Joined
Jan 27, 2021
Threads
41
Messages
2,168
Reaction score
6,124
Location
San Diego
Vehicle(s)
2020 Ford Ranger Lariat
Occupation
I/O Psych MSc student
Thank you, so yes like other have mentioned in terms of his usage of percentiles, they used a top 10% of rough housing customer and tested them to run past 150k miles without major repairs. so the rest of the 90% will have plenty more reliability in terms of mileage and repairs. That's even better than what I was reporting beforehand with the flip situation in terms of percentiles. So in regards to the OP, an EVEN better position now to feel secure with the reliability.
Sponsored

 
 



Top