Oil dilution in Mustang or RS 2.3L ecoboosts?

T-Wrecks

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I've changed oil 2x in my Ranger and a bunch of times for two 1.6 EB (Focus ST and Escape) and a 1.5 EB (Escape) and only the Ranger has oil dilution issues. All are DI so why only the Ranger? I was hoping to go 5K between oil changes but I'm sticking with 4K it's that bad. Do the other 2.3L EBs in the Mustang and Focus RS suffer the same thing?
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What type of oil are you running? If the oil is not API SN Plus Resource Conserving or DEXOS1 Gen Type 2 rated this could be the issue. I had this problem with my GTI until I switched to API SN Plus Resource Conserving rated oil. Once I did that the dilution issue went away. I'm running the same spec oil on the Ranger and so far have not had an issue.

Also, does the Focus and Escape come equipped with the oil separator like the Ranger? Ford started putting oil separators on the PCV system to reduce carbon build up on the intake valves by reducing the amount of oil reaching them. This could be inadvertently causing some of the fuel blow by to mix with the oil vapor and return to the crankcase during normal operation. The Resource Conserving rated oil is engineered to resist dilution much better than non-resource conserving oil types.
 
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I've been using the same oil for years, Mobil 1. In the Escapes it's been OEM motorcraft semi-synthetic. I don't see how oil type results in gas accumulation in oil but it's not that. If the Ranger has an oil separator why do they sell kits to add them?
 

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I've been using the same oil for years, Mobil 1. In the Escapes it's been OEM motorcraft semi-synthetic. I don't see how oil type results in gas accumulation in oil but it's not that. If the Ranger has an oil separator why do they sell kits to add them?

The additives in the oil will alter it's ability to mix with gasoline and water condensate. Older US oil types did not resist dilution when the GDI engines first hit the market and thus suffered significant issues with carbon buildup on the valves unlike European GDI cars. In the EU market they addressed this dilution very early on and mandated upgrades to the oil and significantly reduced the instances of this dilution as well as other related issues with GDI engines. The NA oil market was slow to adapt and update the API standards to meet the Euro-spec motor oil market.

This article goes into detail about the issue and how the oil type used plays a role.
https://www.motor.com/magazine-summary/old-new-oil-new-engines-august-2018

Oil catch cans are available because the aftermarket saw an issue with early GDI engines and marketed products to resolve it. They are still available because not all GDI engines have separators, they work, and people buy them. Are they still needed? It depends on the application. GDI only engines will still suffer from buildup on the valves because there is nothing preventing it. The addition of factory oil separators and newer oils that resist the issues created by GDI engines have helped but without having gasoline and the included detergents coming in contact with the valves on a regular basis the issue will always be present.

Many car makers are updating GDI engines to dual port injection or by adding low psi injectors to the intake. The shift to dual port is a step up effort to reduce low-speed preignition(LSPI) by using port injection, then shifting to direct injection at higher rpm/boost situations. This method of fuel delivery is resolving many of the issues early GDI engines had with oil dilution, LSPI, intake valve buildup etc. Ford has started updating their GDI engines with dual port injection, but sadly the 2.3L has not received this update. Others like Toyota have started adding a single low PSI pre-injector to the intake and have the ECU regularly activate it to reduce the intake valve buildup.
 


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Neither of those 2 articles has anything on oil type affecting fuel dilution. Oil and gasoline are 100% miscible so the issue isn't the oils ability to resist mixing with gasoline (it can't), it's fuel getting into the oil in the first place. My question is it just the Ranger 2.3 or do other 2.3 have the same fuel dilution issues? My other 1.6 and 1.5 ecoboost don't have this problem. This isn't directly related to carbon build up on intake valves which is also another issue with GDI.
 

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Neither of those 2 articles has anything on oil type affecting fuel dilution. Oil and gasoline are 100% miscible so the issue isn't the oils ability to resist mixing with gasoline (it can't), it's fuel getting into the oil in the first place. My question is it just the Ranger 2.3 or do other 2.3 have the same fuel dilution issues? My other 1.6 and 1.5 ecoboost don't have this problem. This isn't directly related to carbon build up on intake valves which is also another issue with GDI.
Did you read the part I said about the possibility of a leaking injector? I don’t have oil/fuel dilution issues and I haven’t read of any on here with it either. So check the Mustang forums for more information and see if there are things you should check. Otherwise take it to the dealer since it’s under warranty.
 

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Neither of those 2 articles has anything on oil type affecting fuel dilution. Oil and gasoline are 100% miscible so the issue isn't the oils ability to resist mixing with gasoline (it can't), it's fuel getting into the oil in the first place. My question is it just the Ranger 2.3 or do other 2.3 have the same fuel dilution issues? My other 1.6 and 1.5 ecoboost don't have this problem. This isn't directly related to carbon build up on intake valves which is also another issue with GDI.

How do you know you have a fuel dilution issue? Have you sent out oil samples to be tested? Having read the white papers on it, to test for this one would need specialty testing equipment or access to a lab with the appropriate hardware and is not something that the vast majority of people would have access to.



As to the article, It does go over it, plus there is a plethora of research published on the matter as well.

Due to changes in injection and combustion, TGDI engines produce increased soot and fuel dilution. The soot can cause a rapid increase in the viscosity of the oil, while the increased fuel dilution can accelerate wear during and after injection....

To sustain the shift to TGDI engines, carmakers need motor oils engineered to prevent or sufficiently mitigate these issues—specifically, higher performing oils under TGDI
engine operating conditions, with improved oxidation control, cleaning and antiwear properties—so that combustion can be controlled...

On Nov. 9, 2017, the API Lubricants Standards Group approved the adoption of API SN Plus and SN Plus Resource Conserving (which includes energy-conserving properties SN Plus doesn’t).

European synthetic motor oils formulated to ACEA specs use different base oils than their North American synthetic—and even full synthetic—counterparts.

Here’s what we’ve been told about the European engine oil experience with both GDI and TGDI engines using ACEA spec synthetic motor oil, compared to the same engines here in North America on API/ILSAC full synthetic engine oil:
  • The engines in Europe perform better and last longer.
  • The engines in Europe don’t have incomplete combustion issues.
  • Over their lifetime, it costs less to maintain GDI and TGDI engines in Europe.
Customers here who use the lower quality oil end up paying more for maintaining their vehicles (for induction cleaning and engine rebuilding/replacement, for example)...

But with the shift to manufacturing a growing number of their vehicles with TGDI engines, domestic and Asian automakers have been pressing their lubricant and additive manufacturing cohorts in API to develop engine oils engineered to address LSPI and other TGDI concerns...

According to API, “SN Plus and SN Plus Resource Conserving will be the proper motor oils for your operation. Both make it easier for consumers to select engine oils designed specifically for use with GDI and TGDI engines. And both address resolving LSPI issues, offer improved protection for timing chains, valvetrain components, stop-start engines or any vehicle that features frequent starts and/or starts after extended periods of downtime.”
If you're using oil branded with just SN Plus it will not have the same properties the RC compliant oil does and may experience issues as a result.
 
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Injector leaking is not caused by oil. It maybe my problem, but is it a problem only in the Ranger? How do I know? The oil smells like gasoline and has an obvious loss of viscosity compared to other EB engines. I've been working on engines for over 40 years (changing oil on EB since 2015) so I tend to notice things that are unusual. This is definitely unusual. Again I'd like to know if this is only an issue with just the Ranger 2.3.
 

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Injector leaking is not caused by oil. It maybe my problem, but is it a problem only in the Ranger? How do I know? The oil smells like gasoline and has an obvious loss of viscosity compared to other EB engines. I've been working on engines for over 40 years (changing oil on EB since 2015) so I tend to notice things that are unusual. This is definitely unusual. Again I'd like to know if this is only an issue with just the Ranger 2.3.
You are exceptionally persistent in asking if this is a Ranger specific issue when you are missing the point of our prior attempts to help you.

This engine is used in a multitude of vehicles over the Ford lineup. Therefore it’s not possible to say this is a Ranger specific problem that you are noticing.

I don’t understand your resistance towards our prior suggestions such as the injector possibly sticking open. I never mentioned it was a problem caused by oil... it’s a problem FOR your oil because it would contaminate the oil with gasoline. Therefore, it’s a potential problem to investigate by the dealer. Because like I mentioned before, it’s under warranty so take it in.

Why try to argue with us about it? No one is right or wrong. We are trying to help...
 
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It's based on but NOT the same 2.3 engine used in the Mustang or RS so thus the question of if it's only Ranger specific. It certainly could be. BTW the mustang and RS are not the same either, I know the heads are different. Those other engines have been around for awhile so there should be a resolution if there is an issue, or we just live with it and change oil more often. I'm not arguing but it seems like there is a communication issue here.
 

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It's based on but NOT the same 2.3 engine used in the Mustang or RS so thus the question of if it's only Ranger specific. It certainly could be. BTW the mustang and RS are not the same either, I know the heads are different. Those other engines have been around for awhile so there should be a resolution if there is an issue, or we just live with it and change oil more often. I'm not arguing but it seems like there is a communication issue here.
I’d love to help but it doesn’t seem like anything I suggest to you is considered. Fuel leaking from a faulty injector is significant and could cause the symptoms you suggest. I don’t know how extreme your issue is... if it’s just a smell of gasoline then that’s not alarming. If the oil runs like water then that’s an alarming issue

A different turbo and cams doesn’t make it a completely different engine. The architecture is the same and so is the delivery system for fuel as well as PCV design. Therefore, it would exhibit similar symptoms if it was a wide spread issue with this engine design pertaining to dilution.

However, it’s not. So take it to the dealer.
 

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Hi Folks,

I for the most part stay out of these kinds of threads but I have a puzzlement. Doesn't the oil get hot enough to vaporize any fuel in the oil which would be drawn into the intake mainfold and burned? I must be missing something here...

Best,
Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retired
 
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That's what I think Phil. Based on the distillation curve of gasoline it shouldn't be an issue, but it is (the upper end is around 210 C). How hot does oil get in a turbo?

For those who offered advice thanks. But please understand I'm not taking it to a dealer until I confirm I have an issue. I'm not letting those idiots go nuts on my truck. This maybe one of those things, and based on what I'm hearing it might just be. It seems like the more severe cases the oil level increases. Mine isn't doing that so I'm not really concerned about it (plus I only have 8,000 miles). But I still want to know if it's acceptable to be this way or not.
 

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T-Wrecks,

The only way to be 100% positive that there is a significant dilution issue is to have the oil tested. Just because it smells of gasoline does not necessarily mean it has been diluted to the point of not being able to provide proper lubrication or that there is an underlying mechanical issue with one or more injectors. If this truly is of a major concern to you, then have the oil tested several intervals during the time frame between oil-changes. This will provide you an accurate report at the severity of the problem if it exists. From there you can take that to Ford to be properly addressed. Until then just going by what the oil smells like is not a definitive way to determine there being an issue.



Hi Paul,

Under normal operation the PCV system will pull a large percentage of the vaporized fuel back into the intake to be burned along with water condensation and oil. Since gasoline readily bonds with oil a portion of the blow-by will be lost to this and be deposited back into the crankcase where it will remain until the next oil change. Since the 2.3L in the Ranger has an oil separator, the unit could also by design cause an increased amount of fuel vapor to bond with the engine oil. It is hard to calculate what percentage of un-burned fuel bonds with oil, and what passes on to return to the intake. People who have installed catch cans have confirmed they are successful in removing a significant volume of condensate that has a heavy fuel odor to it. Another thing to consider is when the engine shuts off or is under heavy boost, the PCV system shuts down and the concentration of un-burned fuel in the crankcase increases, and allows for a greater amount of dilution into the oil vapor present in the crank case until it has had time to settle after shut down or removed via ventilation by the PCV.
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