Previous Gen Rangers

dmeyer302

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I enjoyed the 1998 Ranger I had when I was just out of high school. It was a good truck...for me, and for the time. I've also driven several others of my family's and at work.

However, into the late 2000's decade, it was becoming pretty obvious that Ford was hanging the Ranger out to dry. This was frustrating for me as I really liked the size class but was disappointed in the Ranger not keeping up with the times.

Towards the end, I'm sure sales were tapering off, so Ford decided to kill it. Well, was anyone surprised? I remember reading that marketing thought Ranger buyers would cross-shop with the newly introduced Fiesta because they were looking for the cheapest thing they could find.

I hope @P. A. Schilke can chime in on this, I'm sure he has some thoughts :) Were you ever actively restricted from improving the Ranger to prevent cannibalizing the oh-so-precious F-150? Did you ever work with the F-series guys?
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P. A. Schilke

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I enjoyed the 1998 Ranger I had when I was just out of high school. It was a good truck...for me, and for the time. I've also driven several others of my family's and at work.

However, into the late 2000's decade, it was becoming pretty obvious that Ford was hanging the Ranger out to dry. This was frustrating for me as I really liked the size class but was disappointed in the Ranger not keeping up with the times.

Towards the end, I'm sure sales were tapering off, so Ford decided to kill it. Well, was anyone surprised? I remember reading that marketing thought Ranger buyers would cross-shop with the newly introduced Fiesta because they were looking for the cheapest thing they could find.

I hope @P. A. Schilke can chime in on this, I'm sure he has some thoughts :) Were you ever actively restricted from improving the Ranger to prevent cannibalizing the oh-so-precious F-150? Did you ever work with the F-series guys?
Hi Dmeyer,

Yeah...I have a few comments. We had a new Ranger in the works, called the P273 P is for Pickup and 273 was the 273rd program to come before the Top Brass of Ford for a go or no go. We had prototypes running around and were about one and half years into the program when our CEO at the time Jacques Nassar and our Group VP, Derrick Kuzak killed the program because Nassar wanted to put all the money into luxury vehicles to increase profitability in his ill fated dance with Wall Street and Kuzak wanted it killed to force people into the F150 Short Wheel Base as the P273 was more of a midsize than the then current Ranger and Kuzak wanted to retain the Title of Top selling brand for over 40 plus years. All the prototype new Rangers were sent to the crusher...It was a sad day at Truck when the program was killed.

Nassar was an awful CEO in my opinion. He had an idea that an employee that felt he/she could loose their job at any moment was going to be more productive than an employee that felt secure in his/her job. He was hated by so many people. I was at the SEMA show in Las Vegas when Nassar was given the boot. Many of us at the Ford display celebrated way long into the night... Kuzak was a straight shooter that made a bad decision and got axed for it as we gifted Toyota the compact pickup segment. I worked directly for Derrick and always liked him. But he caved to Nassar's pressure and got canned as well. Our leadership for the FI50 was never threatened...

best,
Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retired
 
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dmeyer302

dmeyer302

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Hi Dmeyer,

Yeah...I have a few comments. We had a new Ranger in the works, called the P273 P is for Pickup and 273 was the 273rd program to come before the Top Brass of Ford for a go or no go. We had prototypes running around and were about one and half years into the program when our CEO at the time Jacques Nassar and our Group VP, Derrick Kuzak killed the program because Nassar wanted to put all the money into luxury vehicles to increase profitability in his ill fated dance with Wall Street and Kuzak wanted it killed to force people into the F150 Short Wheel Base as the P273 was more of a midsize than the then current Ranger and Kuzak wanted to retain the Title of Top selling brand for over 40 plus years. All the prototype new Rangers were sent to the crusher...It was a sad day at Truck when the program was killed.

Nassar was an awful CEO in my opinion. He had an idea that an employee that felt he/she could loose their job at any moment was going to be more productive than an employee that felt secure in his/her job. He was hated by so many people. I was at the SEMA show in Las Vegas when Nassar was given the boot. Many of us at the Ford display celebrated way long into the night... Kuzak was a straight shooter that made a bad decision and got axed for it as we gifted Toyota the compact pickup segment. I worked directly for Derrick and always liked him. But he caved to Nassar's pressure and got canned as well. Our leadership for the FI50 was never threatened...

best,
Phil Schilke
Ranger Vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retired
Phil,

That's fascinating. I'd love to see pics of that P273.....I'm assuming you either don't have any or aren't allowed to share :lipssealed:

Did you ever work with the Explorer Sport Trac? I always thought they would have sold a ton more of those if they had just called it a four-door Ranger.

Daniel
 

P. A. Schilke

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Phil,

That's fascinating. I'd love to see pics of that P273.....I'm assuming you either don't have any or aren't allowed to share :lipssealed:

Did you ever work with the Explorer Sport Trac? I always thought they would have sold a ton more of those if they had just called it a four-door Ranger.

Daniel
Hi Daniel,

I do not have any pictures of the P273. Not a good idea to have such pictures as there were strict guidelines for taking pictures of the prototypes. We had enough trouble with the Automotive Press lurking around the entrance to the Dearborn Proving Grounds (DPG) with telephoto lenses etc.

Yes, When I had Chassis CAE, My engineers did all the analysis on the chassis for the Explorer, Explorer Sport and the Explorer Sport Trac... Sport Track was viewed as a nitch product, catering to a small group of folks. As I recall, it did not sell very well in some areas of of the country. We have a good friend here in Green Valley that has a Sport Trac...she just loves it ... over 250,000 miles...she will not sell it as she is so fond of it. Another one that is also Silver running around too...Must live close.
 

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There were a lot of conspiracy theories about ford killing the ranger to protect the f150 but I think the reality was that ford was worried about spending the capital to release a new truck domestically (this was still only a couple of years after the other big automakers declared bankruptcy), sales were dropping fast, and they hoped that f150 sales would help offset the loss of the ranger. It's a lot easier to think that the midsize market taking off was obvious if you look at it in hindsight. But at the time what was known was 1) ford couldn't keep selling the smaller cheaper ranger 2) the market for a bigger more expensive ranger was unknown and 3) ford couldn't afford to lose a couple billion on an experiment.
 


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dmeyer302

dmeyer302

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There were a lot of conspiracy theories about ford killing the ranger to protect the f150 but I think the reality was that ford was worried about spending the capital to release a new truck domestically (this was still only a couple of years after the other big automakers declared bankruptcy), sales were dropping fast, and they hoped that f150 sales would help offset the loss of the ranger. It's a lot easier to think that the midsize market taking off was obvious if you look at it in hindsight. But at the time what was known was 1) ford couldn't keep selling the smaller cheaper ranger 2) the market for a bigger more expensive ranger was unknown and 3) ford couldn't afford to lose a couple billion on an experiment.
That's probably the best explanation I've heard, but it doesn't *really* hold up when you consider the ROW Ranger that always existed. One Ford was the best thing Mulally ever did. Ok, maybe second best after the line of credit thing that saved them from the bailouts.
 

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That's probably the best explanation I've heard, but it doesn't *really* hold up when you consider the ROW Ranger that always existed. One Ford was the best thing Mulally ever did. Ok, maybe second best after the line of credit thing that saved them from the bailouts.
Ford spent close to $1bn retooling production for the current ranger, in addition to whatever they spent for the US-specific changes and compliance. There are some savings from a global platform, but a new product is still really capital intensive. So the question is, without the benefit of hindsight, how much risk would ford have taken on making that kind of investment 9 years ago? (That is, how likely were they to recoup the costs, and what would failure have meant to the company.) And, that investment wouldn't have been in the current plant (which was unavailable then) so the calculation would need include whether it would have made sense to pump that money into the obsolete Twin Cities plant, bump production somewhere else, or build something new.
 

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That's probably the best explanation I've heard, but it doesn't *really* hold up when you consider the ROW Ranger that always existed. One Ford was the best thing Mulally ever did. Ok, maybe second best after the line of credit thing that saved them from the bailouts.
It does not really hold up at all... The money was reinvested in Luxury Brand...Lincoln..but the financial logic was wrong.The company never recooped the investment. Ranger was already paid for so each sale was incremental profit. P273 should have never been cancelled. Being on the inside, it was the as I said. If you are going to throw around numbers...At the time, a new clean sheet of paper to a vehicle was $3 Billion

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Phil Schilke
Range Vehicle Engineering
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VAMike

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It does not really hold up at all... The money was reinvested in Luxury Brand...Lincoln..but the financial logic was wrong.The company never recooped the investment. Ranger was already paid for so each sale was incremental profit. P273 should have never been cancelled. Being on the inside, it was the as I said. If you are going to throw around numbers...At the time, a new clean sheet of paper to a vehicle was $3 Billion
Hindsight is 20/20. Ford isn't the only company that misread the luxury market. One possibility is that everyone that did so was a complete idiot, the other possibility is that people do their best and sometimes they're right and sometimes they're wrong. A new ranger wasn't already paid for unless someone built a line in a factory and then...didn't use it? Old ranger was paid for but its sales were going down the toilet and there's nothing that could have brought people in to buy something that small given the options available.

If ford had invested in a new ranger, hit a rough patch, and declared bankruptcy it would be just as obvious in hindsight that investing in the ranger when midsize trucks were such a small market was idiotic and completely irresponsible.
 

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Hindsight is 20/20. Ford isn't the only company that misread the luxury market. One possibility is that everyone that did so was a complete idiot, the other possibility is that people do their best and sometimes they're right and sometimes they're wrong. A new ranger wasn't already paid for unless someone built a line in a factory and then...didn't use it? Old ranger was paid for but its sales were going down the toilet and there's nothing that could have brought people in to buy something that small given the options available.

If ford had invested in a new ranger, hit a rough patch, and declared bankruptcy it would be just as obvious in hindsight that investing in the ranger when midsize trucks were such a small market was idiotic and completely irresponsible.
I was on track to buy my Fourth new Ranger in 2012-13.
My 2001 Ranger instantly increased in value substantially the day the last Ranger rolled off the line, and virtually stopped depreciating until the 2019 Ranger was announced.
That says something for the Ranger since I was approached dozens of times over the last several years with offers to buy mine for good money.
 

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I was on track to buy my Fourth new Ranger in 2012-13.
My 2001 Ranger instantly increased in value substantially the day the last Ranger rolled off the line, and virtually stopped depreciating until the 2019 Ranger was announced.
That says something for the Ranger since I was approached dozens of times over the last several years with offers to buy mine for good money.
And there are still people buying rear engine bugs, but it isn't a large market and there's no way vw could make money selling them.
 

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And there are still people buying rear engine bugs, but it isn't a large market and there's no way vw could make money selling them.
They did eventually bring the Ranger back though, and the point is...It was a big mistake to discontinue it.
Don't underestimate the interference of the Government regulations. Much of the new Ranger is the result of compromises to accommodate regulations and not responses to customer demand.
Did you ever own the last generation Ranger ?
 

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They did eventually bring the Ranger back though, and the point is...It was a big mistake to discontinue it.
They brought back a different (bigger/more expensive) ranger. Only with the benefit of hindsight is it obvious that the market for bigger & more expensive small trucks is as large as it is. Even with that, I'm not sure Ford would be jumping in now if they weren't planning to share production with the bronco and mitigate some risk with diversity.
Don't underestimate the interference of the Government regulations. Much of the new Ranger is the result of compromises to accommodate regulations and not responses to customer demand.
I'm not underestimating anything--it's pretty much my point. Ford had to make a different truck than the truck they were making, for a whole lot of reasons, and it wasn't necessarily the case that the capital investment needed to do that was the best use of the capital. In hindsight after toyota started selling $30k+ tacomas like hotcakes it was obvious that there was a market for higher priced mid-size trucks, but it's a lot easier to criticize people for missing things in hindsight than it is to always make the right call looking forward.
 

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They brought back a different (bigger/more expensive) ranger. Only with the benefit of hindsight is it obvious that the market for bigger & more expensive small trucks is as large as it is. Even with that, I'm not sure Ford would be jumping in now if they weren't planning to share production with the bronco and mitigate some risk with diversity.

I'm not underestimating anything--it's pretty much my point. Ford had to make a different truck than the truck they were making, for a whole lot of reasons, and it wasn't necessarily the case that the capital investment needed to do that was the best use of the capital. In hindsight after toyota started selling $30k+ tacomas like hotcakes it was obvious that there was a market for higher priced mid-size trucks, but it's a lot easier to criticize people for missing things in hindsight than it is to always make the right call looking forward.
:clap:Interesting point of view and you are welcome to it...At least I don't want any part of it!;):giggle:
So did you ever own one?
 

P. A. Schilke

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:clap:Interesting point of view and you are welcome to it...At least I don't want any part of it!;):giggle:
So did you ever own one?
Pointless to waste time arguing anymore...

Best,
Phil Schilke
Ranger vehicle Engineering
Ford Motor Co. Retired
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