Ranger compared to Subaru in snow

[12Bravo20]

Out here, those coming from the likes of CA or southern states quickly find their wide aggressive tires are great for rocks and the desert, but next to worthless in deep snow.

So very true.

And that is why I normally will keep the stock tire sizes on my AWD or 4WD vehicles. I buy them more for getting around in bad winter weather than for playing in the mud.

I live in a very small town that is fairly flat and still need a 4WD or AWD vehicle for getting around during the winter months. The closest town is 7 miles away with a few hills big enough to cause issues for two wheel drive vehicles. Plus the major road int he area is considered a secondary road by the state so it doesn't get cleared like primary roads do.

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[dtech]

Raptor vs Outback
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I didn't watch the video because long ago I concluded that TFL is pretty useless, who wouldn't choose a Ford Raptor over an Outback - only one small issue is that a Raptor can cost 2 to 3 times more than an outback as well as consuming way more gas, cost much more to insure, just another worthless TFL comparison. Doubt that there will be a rush of Subaru owners headed to Ford to buy a Raptor.

 

[mtbikernate]

I didn't watch the video because long ago I concluded that TFL is pretty useless, who wouldn't choose a Ford Raptor over an Outback - only one small issue is that a Raptor can cost 2 to 3 times more than an outback as well as consuming way more gas, cost much more to insure, just another worthless TFL comparison. Doubt that there will be a rush of Subaru owners headed to Ford to buy a Raptor.

they basically concluded that tires make an enormous difference for both stopping and accelerating and that the stock tires on the subie were crap in snow compared to the stock tires on the raptor. they also mentioned that they'll be doing a different vid where they actually use snow tires

 

[Dgc333]

FWIW, the TV show Every Day Driver proposed a question as to why put your sports car away in the winter. They went on to test a Nissan Rogue AWD with the factory all season tires against a Mazda Miata with winter tires.

The Rogue could pull away from a stop quicker than the Mazda but the Mazda could stop in a much shorter distance. Ultimately the Rogue could manage much deeper snow than the Mazda but any direction changes the Mazda was much much better. They had a little road course setup and the Rogue would get a jump off the line but the Mazda would catch right up and then walk away from the Rogue. They also had a salon course and it was quite amazing how much better the Mazda was.

Their conclusion was there was no reason to park your sports car in the winter if you put winter tires on it.

 

[VAMike]

The Rogue could pull away from a stop quicker than the Mazda but the Mazda could stop in a much shorter distance. Ultimately the Rogue could manage much deeper snow than the Mazda but any direction changes the Mazda was much much better. They had a little road course setup and the Rogue would get a jump off the line but the Mazda would catch right up and then walk away from the Rogue. They also had a salon course and it was quite amazing how much better the Mazda was.

Weight is a huge factor, and the rogue is 150% the weight of the miata (3500ish vs 2400ish). p=m*v, F=m*a, and the amount of rubber on the ground hasn't grown as fast as the fashion for big vehicles. One of the reasons that in real world driving a subaru wagon is often a better choice than a midsize or fullsize truck, regardless of "traction".

 

[Dgc333]

Weight is a huge factor, and the rogue is 150% the weight of the miata (3500ish vs 2400ish). p=m*v, F=m*a, and the amount of rubber on the ground hasn't grown as fast as the fashion for big vehicles. One of the reasons that in real world driving a subaru wagon is often a better choice than a midsize or fullsize truck, regardless of "traction".

The intent of that show was to demonstrate that choosing the right rubber can transform a vehicle in the snow and slop.

 

[dtech]

I've seen people driving sports cars in the snow on I-70 in the CO mtns, once saw a corvette doing it in a pretty heavy snowstorm, but it was on the downslope towards Denver

FWIW, the TV show Every Day Driver proposed a question as to why put your sports car away in the winter. They went on to test a Nissan Rogue AWD with the factory all season tires against a Mazda Miata with winter tires.

The Rogue could pull away from a stop quicker than the Mazda but the Mazda could stop in a much shorter distance. Ultimately the Rogue could manage much deeper snow than the Mazda but any direction changes the Mazda was much much better. They had a little road course setup and the Rogue would get a jump off the line but the Mazda would catch right up and then walk away from the Rogue. They also had a salon course and it was quite amazing how much better the Mazda was.

Their conclusion was there was no reason to park your sports car in the winter if you put winter tires on it.

Some people don't put their sports cars away in winter, some years back driving back to Denver on I-70 from the mtns in a heavy snowstorm I had to blink and look twice as I passed a corvette, it seemed to be doing ok. Now one can get cited for not having proper tires or awd, but no one does unless they are in an accident. Maybe the vette had snows on it, I dunno.

 

[CraigR209]

I owned two Subaru Legacys for over 10 years before buying my Ranger. Other than ground clearance the Subie can’t be beat. Never had worries in any condition in any season, the AWD was great whether rain or snow. Ranger is very capable but takes a little more thought in making sure you’re set for the conditions.

 

[Elgorr4]

A ranger in 4wd has more straight line traction than an awd subaru. Despite having very similar advertised clearance, the ranger has a much higher "average clearance" and will be able to handle much deeper snow before getting stuck. Unfortunately, roads are not straight. Roads are also usually plowed, and the depth of snow on a road is almost never deep enough to stop a subaru, let alone a ranger. When turning, because the 4wd system locks front and rear wheel speeds, the ranger has wheel spin which reduces traction. Turn your truck around in 4wd in a dry parking lot and listen to the tires chirp. This is literally loss of traction. When you take a snowy corner at 30mph, the 4wd vehicle's tires WILL spin at a different speed than you are teavelling. This loss of traction is noticable and unsettling. Whether or not it causes the vehicle to lose traction completely is dependent on a bunch of factors, but the AWD subaru will not spin the tires, and therefore will have better handling in the corner. That is a fact. Another fact is that pickup trucks have TERRIBLE weight distribution. They have objectively worse handling than sedans and wagons in all conditions. On a road course, a subaru will lap any pickup regardless of power, because at high speeds pickups loose traction first. Now day to day you aren't jamming around corners so the pickup handling is fine, but whether you are at the edge of traction because of high speeds or a slippery (snowy) surface, the handling of the subaru wins every time. Subarus are better snow vehicles than any pickup. Yes in a straight line the ranger in 4H might have an edge in traction, but braking and cornering are the much more important driving dynamics that Wes is ignoring. Source: I valet cars in a location that receives over 500" of snow a year. I have driven them all in all conditions and can say without a doubt that awd is superior for general driving in the snow. For pulling out of a snowbank after a 100" storm clearance is king, but for driving a 9% canyon road with hairpin turns in a blizzard, I'll take the Subaru 11/10 times.

 

[Wes Siler]

I’ll tell you what, it warmed up the last 2 days, 33ish and I missed being able to drive aggressive! Traction was superb, no ice at all, zigzagging going 55!
@Wes Siler I’ll give it to ya, in these conditions who needs a Subaru?!

Once you've taken the time to learn how to use it, you can really take advantage of the superior traction 4WD offers. You should probably be on on a real snow tire though. Loving the Hakapallittas I've got on the Ranger this years.

I also own a 200 series Land Cruiser, which has a full-time 4WD system, meaning it nominally operates in AWD, but can lock its center diff, and enter 4WD with the press of a button. That center diff is also a TorSen design, which is significantly more capable than anything you'll find in a crossover. More on that here:

While having such a capable AWD system is really convenient around town, constantly crossing mixed conditions from ice to bare pavement, etc, I still primarily consider it to be a safety aid. Once I've crossed onto uniform snow (or go off-road), I still need to switch on 4WD to maximize progress and control. The same goes for any obstacle, like parallel parking on a snow bank, climbing a steep icy ramp out of a parking lot, etc. And that's before we even talk about really gnarly conditions.

Go back to that description of wheel speed matching (which is how you define traction, not power apportionment), and you'll see that even with bandaids like that TorSen, or the power of imagination (what most Subaru owners use), AWD simply cannot hope to match the traction provided by basic 4WD. And that's before we start talking systems like Terrain Management, or locking diffs.

If you bought a Ranger, you own a really, really capable truck. Learn how to use it, and you'll maximize the value you get out of it.

 

[mtbikernate]

I might get to do my own Subie vs. Ranger snow driving comparison on Sunday. Of course, no winter tires on either vehicle. All-seasons on the subie, and the OEM Hankook all-terrains on the Ranger.

8-12" of wet, heavy snow melting from the bottom up due to the warm ground. good times. will probably be gone a couple days after it falls, too.

 

[Wes Siler]

I might get to do my own Subie vs. Ranger snow driving comparison on Sunday. Of course, no winter tires on either vehicle. All-seasons on the subie, and the OEM Hankook all-terrains on the Ranger.

8-12" of wet, heavy snow melting from the bottom up due to the warm ground. good times. will probably be gone a couple days after it falls, too.

Take recovery gear.

 

[mtbikernate]

Take recovery gear.

lol, nah. gonna drive around my neighborhood and may end up a mile from the house at most. before I shovel my steepass driveway, I'm going to try driving both vehicles out of the way. haven't had more than an inch or two of snow since I bought the Ranger, so I want a feel for how it handles and what to expect.

and the temps are supposed to be close enough to freezing that the discussion is about how much ice vs. how much snow. too much ice and I'm not even going to bother with it. I have salt for the driveway and beyond that I'm just going to relax in the house with a fire going. maybe play with the dog in the yard. it's going to get above freezing on Monday and I don't have to be anywhere.

 

[PltFX4]

Huummm... OP, good question...
I've had 3 Subaru Legacy's, 3 Ranger 4x4, and 3 Volvo sedans w/AWD and 1 Volvo SUV and finally, 1 MB C-Class with 4-Matic. ALL always had Blizzak winter snow tires.

What I learned:
Generally, in modest snow or ice, the sedans/SUV did great. The Ranges, not as well... UNTIL I added 400 lbs in the bed, then the Ranger was best.
In deep snow, the Ranger w/the extra weight and SUV were mostly unstoppable; while the sedans would get high centered and would come to a stop. If you could get a "flying" start and maintain momentum, you could usually make it, but if you had to slow down (and when didn't you) or stop, getting started again could be a challenge.

Timely topic as I just came from running errands in the Ranger SuperCrew after a couple inches of snow... and no extra weight... yet... and it is decidedly ass-end light. Ordering up the weight this week... I'll let you know the after impressions... we got more snow coming.

PS: East Coasters - looks like you go some serious snow coming your way... be careful.

 

[Dgc333]

Ballast in the back of a pickup is the key to getting around in the snow. When I was in high school and college I worked at a service station that was in the corner of a strip plaza. We plowed the entire parking lot with a 2wd pickup. In order to do this effectively we would put three 55 gallon drums filled with water in the bed no amount of snow ever stopped this pickup.

I live south east of Boston near the coast. The storm blew through today and for us it was all rain. Only had to go in land another 15 miles and the snow was 8 to 15 inches.

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